Chairman Comer (00:00): Mr. Galanis (02:50:00):
... text messages, Suspicious Activity Reports at Treasury and other evidence normally compiled during an expansive investigation such as this. The Oversight Committee has found no credible evidence of the Bidens providing any work product. The Committee has identified no legitimate value or document or even one single hour of work the Bidens have provided their business partners. Nothing. What is apparent, after over a year of investigation, is that the Bidens do not work in any traditional sense of the word. They do not work as consultants or lawyers or advisors. The Bidens don't sell a product or service or a set of skills. The Bidens sell Joe Biden. That is their business. For months, we have heard Democrats desperately proclaiming that witnesses have told this committee that Joe Biden had no involvement in his family's business dealings. But where are those witnesses today? It's telling Democrats haven't invited one of these witnesses to today's hearing. That's because they know their testimonies would not withstand public scrutiny. Democrats have relied on these witnesses' opening statements and have willfully turned a blind eye to the facts that have come out in these interviews once the witnesses were questioned about our record of evidence. Democrats now must rely on bringing in a distraction witness to talk about nonsense and who can't talk about any of the facts brought by today's witnesses who worked with the Bidens. (01:49) Now, President Biden cannot control his adult son. He cannot control his brother, his sister-in-Law or his nine family members who have received money from these transactions. All President Biden can do is control his own actions, and that is what we are here today to discuss with the witnesses. Because in the course of this investigation, we have learned that Joe Biden has taken action after action to further his family's plans to get rich. He shows up to meetings, gets on phone calls, shakes hands and tells people to, quote, "Look after my family." He goes to dinners with foreign oligarchs and a Ukrainian executive paying his son millions of dollars. He gets paid with money from Chinese businessmen who he has meetings with and tells other business associates he'll see what he can do to help their situations. He writes letters of recommendation for foreign business associates' children. (02:50) The scam is simple. The Biden family promises they can make a foreign partner's problems go away by engaging the US government. The problems can be anything. A Ukrainian corruption investigation. Moving Russian money to the United States. A Romanian criminal prosecution. Access for China to American energy sources. Joe shows up, shakes a few hands in front of his son and says, quote, "Take care of my boy," or something similar. And the money flows to the tune of tens of millions of dollars. (03:22) It's done over and over again. The Biden family promises Joe's power. Joe Biden shows up and millions of dollars come into the Biden's pockets. Joe Biden is the family's closer. How could he not be? The Bidens aren't doing any other work for these foreign companies that would warrant tens of millions of dollars. There are only two explanations for this. The first is that Joe Biden knows exactly what he's doing and knows a handshake, a wink, and a smile is enough for him to maintain, as Jim Biden famously calls it, "plausible deniability." Or Joe Biden is being led around by his family and has no idea who he's meeting with or what message he is sending and is truly an elderly man with a poor memory. There's no other explanation. Either Joe Biden is complicit or Joe Biden is incompetent. (04:18) Since becoming chairman of this committee in January, 2023, I've promised the investigation into the Biden family's influence peddling would be based on bank records, witness testimony and verifiable facts. After years of Democrats using this committee as a mouthpiece for every conspiracy theory they could find like the Russian collusion hoax, under my leadership, the Committee has returned to real investigations. If Democrats want to spin another Russian hoax, I'll ask them to answer one question. What services did the Bidens provide to earn them and their business associates over $24 million? What did they do for the money? Democrats have the same bank records as we do, and bank records do not lie. The witnesses today are here to talk about Joe Biden. Republicans are here to talk about Joe Biden. If Democrats wish to spend their time beclowning themselves with another Russian collusion hoax for the sake of protecting President Biden, they can do so. (05:11) As I said I would, I've invited Hunter Biden here today to sit alongside his business associates and provide his side of the story. Hunter Biden demanded a public hearing. I've given him one. Maybe he will show up. He has said he isn't, but he loves saying one thing and doing another. At some point, Hunter Biden saying one thing and doing another begins to reflect poorly on his ability to tell the truth at all. But this hearing is not about Hunter Biden. This investigation is not about Hunter Biden. It's about Joe Biden and the lies he continues to tell the American people. With that, I yield to Ranking Member Smith, or Chairman Smith.
Chairman Smith (05:47): Thank you, Chairman Comer and Ranking Member Raskin. From the beginning of this investigation, we've made clear that we will follow the facts wherever they lead. The facts have led us to two conclusions. One, the Biden family has for years traded on Joe Biden's name in order to rake in millions of dollars. Often doing so with his direct knowledge and clear involvement. Two, president Biden has been continually dishonest with the American people about his knowledge of his family's business dealings. We have testimony from multiple witnesses that Joe Biden was the brand. He knew what his son and brother were doing and did nothing to stop it. That alone makes him complicit in a scheme to make money off of his public service. But he was not just complicit. He was, as one of today's witnesses has testified, an enabler of this activity. The evidence of the two IRS whistleblowers who came to the Ways and Means Committee has been affirmed by volumes of material provided to Congress by the testimony of others, and even by the Department of Justice who finally brought charges against Hunter Biden that mirror those called for by the IRS investigators. (07:07) The evidence obtained shows that, one, Joe Biden met with his son's business partners on multiple occasions. He used an alias to exchange dozens of emails with his son's bookkeeper. He took official government action that suspiciously coincided with those meetings and correspondence. The connections between Joe Biden and his son's business practices extended even to the Biden 2020 campaign. At the height of the Democrat primary, Kevin Morris, a Hollywood lawyer who met Hunter Biden at a Joe Biden campaign fundraiser, paid off Hunter Biden's tax liabilities because there was, in his words, quote, "risk personally and politically," if that matter was not swept under the rug. (07:55) Investigators that were interested in pursuing a potential criminal campaign violation were told to stand down. The Biden family relied on the Biden brand so much that evidence has revealed that Hunter Biden believed that, quote, "all this stuff, meaning his legal troubles, would all go away when his dad became president. Why did he believe that? Because for years, the Biden family has personally benefited from Joe Biden's position of power. Joe Biden knew this. He did nothing to stop it and he lied about it. I yield to Jim Jordan. Chairman Jordan.
Chairman Jordan (08:34): I thank the gentlemen. Who planted the pipe bombs on January 6th? Nobody seems to know. Who leaked the Dobbs draft opinion? You know, the leak that led to an assassination attempt on Justice Kavanaugh? How about this one, who left cocaine at the White House? The Biden administration doesn't seem to have time to answer these questions. They're too busy investigating parents at school board meetings, labeling Catholics extremists, retaliating against whistleblowers. They're too busy putting together a sweetheart deal for Hunter Biden, a deal that got laughed out of court. And oh, the guy who put together the deal that got laughed out of court, that's the guy they name special counsel. (09:16) You know what Democrats do have time for? Going after President Trump. They've been doing it for eight years. They spied on his campaign. Then it was the Mueller investigation, 19 lawyers, 40 agents, $30 million, and found nothing. Then it was impeachment, then it was raid his home, then it was a special counsel, then it was the 14th Amendment. The party of democracy said, "We're going to keep the guy off the ballot who's leading in every single poll." The ranking member said that President Trump should be disqualified from even running for office. Thank goodness we have a Supreme Court who disagreed with the ranking member and the Democrats. 9-0. Not 5-4, not 6-3, not 7-2, not 8-1. 9-0, they disagreed. (10:06) Now Democrats say, "How dare, how dare Republicans investigate Joe Biden? How dare they look into the money, the business and the brand?" Millions of dollars, as the chairman said, millions of dollars from foreign entities run through 20 different companies, for what? I mean 20 different companies. For what? Devon Archer told us what it was for. Access to the brand. And the brand was Joe Biden. The brand that played rounds of golf, took calls and meetings, attended lunches and dinners with Hunter Biden and his business partners. The brand that conditioned $1 billion of American tax money on the firing of the prosecutor pressuring the company Hunter Biden sat on the board of, and oh, by the way, was getting paid a million bucks a year. (10:58) Today we're going to learn more about that brand. We're going to learn more about what Mr. Galanis called The Biden Lift. We'll learn about the plausible deniability that Jim Biden talked to Mr. Bobulinski about, and we'll hear about the statement, the rule that governed how the business operated around Joe Biden, the rule that said, "Say it, forget it, write it, regret it." So I want to thank our witnesses for coming here today. They, like the whistleblowers who came to the Ways and Means Committee, are doing it simply because they want the American people to have the truth. I yield back.
Chairman Comer (11:34): Gentleman yields back. Chair now recognizes the ranking member for 12 minutes for his opening statement.
Ranking Member Raskin (11:40): Mr. Chairman, thank you very kindly. With any luck, today marks the end of perhaps the most spectacular failure in the history of congressional investigations, the effort to find a high crime or misdemeanor committed by Joe Biden and then to impeach him for it. In prior hilarious episodes of this long-running madcap series, America got to see the following. (12:06) One, nearly 20 fact witnesses who could not identify a single act of wrongdoing by President Biden, much less a high crime and misdemeanor, and who overwhelmingly testified that Biden was not involved in any of his family's business ventures. Two, three expert witnesses, called by the Majority itself, who said nothing that they had seen in the tens of thousands of pages of documents produced by the Majority even remotely approached the level of a high crime and misdemeanor. Bank records which show exactly what all the witnesses told us, that Joe Biden was not involved in his family member's businesses. Repeated voyeuristic displays of pornographic images by the Majority completely irrelevant to any conceivable legislative or investigative purpose. (12:58) A star witness, Gal Luft, who turned out to be a Chinese agent and an illegal arms trafficker on the run from American justice. And the key piece of evidence which launched the entire zany goose chase, an FD-1023 form in which the FBI duly recorded a completely fictional tip about a $5 million bribe to Vice President Biden, peddled by Alex Smirnov, who has been criminally indicted by a Trump appointed US Attorney, Special Counsel David Weiss, for felony counts of systematically lying to the FBI in constructing a false record about Joe Biden and now sits in jail in California as a flight risk while the world studies his longstanding and extensive ties to Russian intelligence. (13:51) Today, the good chairman and his ace MAGA detectives have finally jumped the shark. The comedy of errors comes crashing to an end as House Republicans in more than a dozen Biden districts beg for mercy and the Committee throws a flabby Hail Mary pass three weeks after the Super Bowl is over. So today, we revisit the fruitless testimony of two more fading star witnesses who have failed to testify to any presidential wrongdoing, much less evidence of high crimes and misdemeanors. (14:23) Both of the Majority witnesses are frustrated would-be business partners of Hunter Biden who tried to leverage the Biden name or the Biden brand, as they keep calling it, but they never got any business off the ground for reasons that will become painfully obvious to anyone watching the proceedings today. Even Hunter Biden, laboring at the time under a serious substance abuse addiction, could tell these were not the type of people he should be doing business with. So rather than representing the Biden brand, which was their ardent wish, they now show up today as loyal servants of Trump world, each of them proudly represented by their very own former Trump White House attorney. (15:05) The first is Mr. Bobulinski, the bitterly disappointed wannabe Hunter business partner, whose famously litigious history includes unsuccessfully suing his own dying father's charity for nearly $1 million, and just last month suing Cassidy Hutchinson for $10 million after she reported that Mr. Bobulinski, wearing a ski mask, met with Mark Meadows, which Ms. Hutchinson has now backed up with actual documentary photographic evidence, something in very short supply in this investigation. Mr. Bobulinski made his hazy allegations against the Bidens public for the first time at a press conference choreographed by the Trump for President campaign, which provided him a venue, a gaggle of journalists, and even a dress shirt that they went out and bought for him to wear to the event. Hours later, Mr. Bobulinski joined the second 2020 presidential debate as Donald Trump's personal guest where he was seated with Kid Rock and Mark Meadows. (16:10) The other star witness, Mr. Galanis, who I believe is appearing by Zoom today, is a serial fraudster and convicted conman. A term I would charitably not use on a witness except it was explicitly bestowed upon him by not one but two different US federal district court judges, including the one who sentenced him to over 15 years in prison for defrauding union pension funds, a Native American tribe and scores of innocent investors. Mr. Galanis was sentenced to pay restitution of over $80 million to his victims. That's a lot of money. That's what Donald Trump was sentenced to pay E. Jean Carroll for in that civil litigation. The very first record of Mr. Galanis' claims against the Biden family appeared, check this out, in the clemency petition that he sent from prison to President Trump. (17:05) But the key point is this, even if we were to believe every single word offered by these utterly compromised and biased witnesses, Mr. Bobulinski and Mr. Galanis, their allegations don't identify any wrongdoing, much less an impeachable offense by President Biden. With the impeachment bus running on empty, our GOP colleagues now are apparently preparing to save face by ending the impeachment farce with criminal referrals. But criminal referrals require evidence of crimes, and the only crimes we have seen are those of the GOP's own star witnesses like Russian asset Alex Smirnov, Chinese agent Gal Luft, Devon Archer and Jason Galanis. (17:53) The minority witness today, our witness, Lev Parnas casts a piercing light on what's really taking place here. And Mr. Parnas has reason to know. He too used to be a mega sycophant peddling lies and disinformation to smear Joe Biden. Today he joins a long line of self exiles from Trump world who could no longer stomach all the corruption and deceit. People like Cassidy Hutchinson, people like Michael Cohen, Sarah Matthews, Alyssa Griffin, General James Mattis, the chair of the joint chiefs of staff, Mark Millie, General John Kelly, and now Vice President Mike Pence who refuses to endorse for president the man he served with. But we do have loyal sycophants still in the room and one day I look forward to hearing their testimony about how they got sunk into this religious cult. (18:53) Mr. Parnas wrote Chairman Comer and me a remarkable letter on July 23rd, 2023. This is the first time I'm meeting him today. He was Rudy Giuliani's, right-hand man, his globe-trotting business partner and language interpreter in the mission to manufacture Ukraine and Burisma-related dirt and smears against Joe Biden in 2018 and 2019. He spent all of his time traveling around the world trying to stage evidence against Joe Biden. In his letter, Parnas explains that the desperate search to find evidence of any kind of Biden corruption was a complete and total bust because there was no evidence to find. He wrote to tell us that not only is there no evidence in Ukraine that Joe Biden did anything improper, but more darkly, the manic search for a smoking gun against Biden became a mission to invent and concoct evidence out of thin air with the act of help of Russian intelligence assets and agents. (20:06) I'm getting to Russia, you haven't heard anything yet, Mr. Chairman. A man who has reckoned with his own moral dissent into Trump world, Lev Parnas is ashamed of what he did to serve the interests of Russian propaganda and Putin's lies, and he wants America to know the truth. He can explain how the Russian- stimulated conspiracy theories and lies that he promoted with Rudy Giuliani live on in the tiresome fabrications spread by Alex Smirnoff and now repeated by this committee like Pavlov's dog. At every turn my colleagues cry, "Russia hoax" even in the face of repeated warnings from Donald Trump's own Treasury Secretary and Secretary of State, from the intelligence community, from Robert Mueller and most recently from Special Counsel Weiss, who was named to office by Donald Trump. (21:01) As Secretary Mnuchin stated, quote, "Russian disinformation campaigns targeting American citizens are a threat to our democracy." That's Secretary Mnuchin, someone that you guys usually defend, but my GOP colleagues continue to cry, "Russia hoax" like cult members selling flowers at the airport. Our colleagues are the ones loyally amplifying the actual Russian hoax, not the Russia hoax, the Russian hoax, the one that Giuliani and Trump and Smirnov have eagerly adopted from Putin and his agents. They participate in this hoax while they shamefully block $60 billion in military assistance to President Zelensky and the besieged Ukrainian people five years after Trump and Giuliani tried to shake President Zelensky down for counterfeit dirt on Joe Biden. And while they continue to parrot these transparent Russian lies, Vladimir Putin wages, his bloody aggressive war on Ukraine, filled with atrocities like the mass kidnapping of children and the rape and slaughter of civilians. (22:11) The MAGA Right's wholesale adoption of this Russian hoax and their sellout of the Ukrainian people by the MAGA Right is an historic betrayal of democracy, freedom in the rule of law. But the defense of democracy begins with fidelity to the truth, and the Oversight Democrats, America's truth squad against this disinformation, is here today to set the record straight. I yield back to you, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Comer (22:40): I would now like to introduce our witnesses, Mr. Tony Bobulinski. Mr. Bobulinski was a business partner of Hunter Biden in a joint venture between a Chinese energy entity, CEFC. Mr. Bobulinski sat for a transcribed interview with the Committee on February 13th, 2024. Mr. Lev Parnas, Mr. Parnas was not a business associate of the Biden family. Mr. Parnas is an entrepreneur, a political activist, and an author. And Mr. Jason Galanis. Mr. Galanis was a business partner of Hunter Biden. Mr. Galanis sat for a transcribed interview with this committee on February 23rd, 2024. We asked the Bureau of Prisons to make him available in person today. They would only provide Mr. Galanis for virtual testimony. Notably, Mr. Galanis applied for CARES Act home confinement, and after a lengthy approval process was approved for home confinement on June 9th, 2023. On June 12th, 2023, I issued a subpoena to Devon Archer for testimony. On the following day, June 13th, 2023, Mr. Galanis' approval was reversed as a result of Department of Justice's intervention. So Mr. Galanis has remained in a federal prison facility. He is currently in Montgomery, Alabama. Mr. Galanis, can you please state for the record who else is in the room with you?
Mr. Galanis (24:06): Yes, Chairman Comer. My counsel and advisor, Mark Paoletta and Nicholas Wise.
Chairman Comer (24:14): Thank you. Pursuant to committee Rule 9G, the witnesses will please stand and raise their right hands. Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony you are about to give is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God? Let the record show that the witnesses all answered in the affirmative. Thank you. You all may be seated. (24:42) We appreciate you all being here today and look forward to your testimony. Let me remind the witnesses that we have read your written statements and they will appear in full in the hearing record. Please limit your oral statements to five minutes. As a reminder, please press the button on the microphone in front of you so that it is on and members can hear you. When you begin to speak, the light in front of you will turn green. After four minutes, the light will turn yellow and when the red light comes on, your five minutes has expired and we would ask that you would please wrap it up as quickly as possible. I now recognize Mr. Bobulinski for his opening statement.
Mr. Bobulinski (25:20): Should I allow Hunter to give his opening statement first?
Chairman Comer (25:23): Well, it doesn't appear Mr. Biden showed up for his public hearing, so we'll recognize you, MMr. Bobulinski.
Mr. Bobulinski (25:28): Okay. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Chairman, ranking members and members of Congress, good morning. Thank you for this opportunity to speak with you and present my truthful testimony to the American people. I sit here today under oath for one reason and one reason only, the American people deserve to hear the truth. Though the truth involving the deep corruption of the Biden family, including the malfeasance of the sitting President of the United States, might be raw and unpleasant, the American people must hear it. You're presented here today with two narratives in this investigation, a false one being pushed by Joe Biden, a serial liar and fabulist, now under this impeachment investigation for public corruption, his brother Jim Biden, a 75-year-old man who can't keep his lies straight, including under oath, and his son, Hunter Biden, a chronic drug addict facing two indictments with 12 counts. (26:18) You also have before you the truth, confirmed by multiple Biden family business partners over many years and backed up by mountains of irrefutable evidence including text messages, emails, documents, recordings. I'm the only Biden family business partner with an impeccable military record. I'm grateful that this country has given me the freedom to be successful. I worked hard to become independently wealthy. I've taken several businesses public, sold multiple businesses to some of the world's best private equity firms. In fact, my business success is why they sought me out. However, what they have done is repugnant to me. I'm here today because I'm a patriot and I'm a truth teller. (26:59) We keep hearing from certain corners that our democracy is at risk and democracy's on the ballot in '24. Yet the same people preaching this mantra know better. They continue to lie directly to the American people without hesitation and remorse. Rep. Dan Goldman and Jamie Raskin, both lawyers, and Mr. Goldman, a former prosecutor with the SDNY from New York, will continue to lie today in this hearing and then go straight to the media to tell more lies. Hunter Biden's defense attorney, Abbe Lowell, weaponizes letters to Congress to try to smear my name-
Ranking Member Raskin (27:32): Mr. Chairman-
Mr. Bobulinski (27:33): ... and misstate the cold hard facts-
Ranking Member Raskin (27:35): Mr. Chairman-
Mr. Bobulinski (27:35): ... in an attempt to save his powerfully connected client and his father. I challenge Mr. Lowell to make those claims on national television so he can be held accountable for his lies. (27:46) Prior to my successful business career, I was an officer in the United States Navy at Navy's Elite Naval Nuclear Power Training Command. I later served as the Command's chief technology officer-
Chairman Comer (28:01): Please proceed. I apologize for the disruption from the [inaudible 00:28:04].
Mr. Bobulinski (28:05): Am I supposed to say it's my time, Mr. Raskin?
Chairman Comer (28:06): Yeah. But please, Mr. Bobulinski, please... Come to order. Mr. Bobulinski, Mr. Bobulinski, please proceed. Please proceed. I apologize for the disruption from the minority.
Mr. Bobulinski (28:18): Okay.
Ranking Member Raskin (28:20): Well, Mr. Chairman, save his time, but he called members of this committee liars, and I just want to know whether the order and decorum requirements of House Rule 11 apply to witnesses appearing before the Committee. Does it apply or does it not?
Mr. Bobulinski (28:40): Should I address? I don't...
Chairman Comer (28:50): There's decorum from the members. We've asked for that. There's no language that I'm aware of pertaining to a witness.
Ranking Member Raskin (28:55): Thank you.
Chairman Comer (28:56): So make sure we didn't waste any of his time on the opening statement. Mr. Bobulinski, I'm sorry for the disruption. Please continue your opening statement.
Mr. Bobulinski (29:07): Yeah, I think Mr. Raskin used my-
Chairman Comer (29:09): We'll make sure it's right. We'll make sure it's right.
Mr. Bobulinski (29:10): Okay, great. I just want to restate, make sure the American people hear all these facts. Abbe Lowell weaponizes letters to Congress to try to smear my name and misstate the cold hard facts in an attempt to save his powerfully connected client and his father. I challenge Mr. Lowell to make those claims on national television so he can be held accountable for his lies. (29:34) Prior to my successful business career, I was an officer for over six years in the United States Navy's Elite Naval Nuclear Power Training Command as a decorated master training specialist. I later served as the Command's chief technology officer, where I held a Q security clearance from the Department of Energy and the NSA. When I left Nuclear Power Training Command, I was the number one ranked direct input officer in the entire command, and then I jumped into the business world in public markets. While I have made a few contributions over the years to Democrats, such as Representative Ro Khanna, I don't see him, but I hope he shows up today, he sits on the Democratic side of the Oversight Committee, I'm not a political person. I come from a family with a long history of distinguished service in our nation's military, including my father, both of my grandfathers, and my brother, all of whom were willing to sacrifice their lives for this great country. My sister serves our military vets for two decades at the Veterans Administration. We've lived our life as a family in service to this great country. (30:35) I hope the American people will pay close attention to this hearing. I also hope they'll understand that some members of this committee will engage in absurd attacks and efforts to try to deflect attention from the facts I will present today by questioning my integrity and my patriotic duty. You may see me speak passionately at this hearing, but for good reason. Not only was I willing to die for this country, every single male member of my immediate family was willing to die for this country. (31:07) I want to be crystal clear from my direct personal experience and what I've subsequently come to learn, it is clear to me that Joe Biden was the brand being sold by the Biden family. His family's foreign influence pedaling operation from China to Ukraine and elsewhere sold out to foreign actors who were seeking to gain influence and access to Joe Biden and the United States government. Joe Biden was more than a participant in and a beneficiary of his family's business, he was an active, aware enabler who met with business associates such as myself, to further the business despite being buffered by a complex scheme to maintain plausible deniability. (31:46) I ask this big question, if there's no evidence of corruption here today, if Joe's conduct and the conduct of his family were fully legal and proper, then why are they so dishonest about it? Not just slight misrepresentations of fact, but deep untruths about the entire corrupt enterprise. Hunter Biden gave his transcribed interview on February 28th and lied throughout his testimony. Here's just one egregious example of Hunter's perjury. He lied to the Committee on important details concerning his money demands and threats to CFC in text messages on July 30th and 31st, 2017. He leveraged his father's presence next to him in that infamous text to strong armed CFC to paying Hunter immediately. (32:33) Jim Biden also lied extensively throughout his transcribed interview on February 21st and perjured himself. An example of that, on page 100 of his transcript, Jim is asked specifically, "Do you recall having a meeting with Hunter Biden, Tony Bobulinski and Joe Biden?" Jim's response, "Absolutely not." The Committee was so shocked by his perjury that they asked him the same question multiple times. Each time, he denied meeting with me and Joe Biden. After the Committee showed him text messages confirming that I met with Joe Biden, Hunter Biden and Jim Biden at the Beverly Hilton in May, 2017, Jim Biden, with a former US attorney lawyer sitting next to him, still denied that meeting took place. Hunter Biden in his own transcribed interview confirmed that that meeting took place. Hunter confirmed his uncle perjured himself in front of this committee. I'm simply here to tell the truth to the American people. And I hope each and every one of you congressmen and women give me the opportunity to do that, instead of focusing on Russia or smearing my family's name or focusing on facts that are irrelevant today. I yield back.
Chairman Comer (33:51): Thank you.
Ranking Member Raskin (33:52): Mr. Chairman, parliamentary inquiry?
Chairman Comer (33:54): Yes?
Ranking Member Raskin (33:54): Just two points. One is I believe that Mr. Bobulinski went over 2 minutes, 14 seconds. I hope the same courtesy
Chairman Comer (33:59): We will
Mr. Comer (34:00): We will give Mr. Parnas equal time.
Mr. Raskin (34:02): Thank you. And secondly, I see that we now have a witness appearing remotely and I thought that witnesses were required to appear in person under the rules adopted by the majority at the beginning of the Congress. And do we have a new practice with respect to that rule? Because I know that members on our side were denied the ability to participate in hearings that were conducted in Florida and Mississippi and Alabama. We wanted to participate by Zoom. So I hope-
Mr. Comer (34:28): And I'll answer that. To be able to testify remotely, requires a letter from me and approval from the majority leader, which we have, and I'll enter that letter into the record without objection.
Mr. Raskin (34:42): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I hope we'll extend the same courtesy to members of this committee when they can't get to a hearing as in Mississippi or Florida. Thank you much.
Mr. Goldman (34:51): Mr. Chairman. Parliamentary inquiry.
Mr. Comer (34:54): State your point.
Mr. Goldman (34:56): Mr. Chairman. Mr. Bobulinski just referred to text messages that I believe he is referring to photos of a Blackberry.
Mr. Comer (35:06): What's your parliamentary inquiry? State your parliamentary inquiry because we've got a very important hearing here and we don't have time for stunts. What's your parliamentary inquiry?
Mr. Goldman (35:14): It's not a stunt. I'm simply asking that Mr. Bobulinski-
Mr. Comer (35:17): You don't have a parliamentary inquiry. Chair now recognizes Mr. Parnas for equal time to Mr. Bobulinski-
Mr. Goldman (35:21): Mr Chairman just because Mr. Bobulinski-
Mr. Comer (35:24): [inaudible 00:35:24]. Chair recognizes Mr. Parnas.
Mr. Goldman (35:25): Mr Chairman, does the committee have the text messages that Mr. Bobulinski-
Speaker 1 (35:30): Mr. Chairman, we don't have time for games by Democrats today.
Mr. Comer (35:33): We have important witnesses here. This is a credible-
Mr. Goldman (35:37): I'm asking a question about the [inaudible 00:35:39] of your important witnesses.
Mr. Comer (35:39): You asked for a parliamentary inquiry. You'll have five minutes whenever Jamie you're asking tells me it's your time to speak. Mr. Parnas, the chair recognizes you for equal time that Mr. Bobulinski had, which was seven minutes.
Mr. Parnas (35:55): Thank you. Hello. Honorable members of Congress, Chairman Comer, Ranking Member Raskin and members of the oversight committee. I'm humbled and thankful before you to show up before you today. I came to the United States from Odessa, Ukraine in 1976 when it was still the former Soviet Union. My mother and father and sister and I had left the Soviet Union escaping antisemitism and persecution. While in Rome en route to Israel, my sister and I won the most important opportunity that we have ever been given. We won the US green card lottery. My family came here with literally no more than shirts on our back and the hopes of rebuilding our lives in the land of freedom. I say this to you because I love this country. From shortly after my arrest on October 9th, 2019 to now, I have been trying to share the irrefutable truth with you. The American people have been lied to by Donald Trump, Rudy Giuliani, and various cohorts of individuals in government and media positions. (36:55) They created falsehoods to serve their own interests knowing it would undermine the strength of our nation. From November 2018 to October 2019, I was a key participant and a witness to numerous efforts to prove that Joe and Hunter Biden were linked to corruption in Ukraine. Rudy Giuliani, on behalf of them, President Donald Trump tasked me with a mission to travel the globe finding dirt on the Bidens so that an array of networks could spread misinformation about them, thus securing the 2020 election for Donald J. Trump. Ironically, when I was arrested, my original indictment linked me to an individual referred to as Unindicted Co-Conspirator One. We now know this individual to be Congressman Pete Sessions who sits on this very committee today. Today, I ask you to consider the following. In nearly a year traveling the world and interviewing officials in different countries, I found precisely zero evidence of the Biden's corruption in Ukraine. (37:49) No credible source has ever provided proof of criminal activity, not the FBI, CIA, nor the NSA. No respectable Ukrainian official has ever said that the Biden did anything illegal, including former President Poroshenko and former prosecutor General Yuri Lutsenko. Even when CEO of Burisma, Mykola Zlochevsky was offered a deal by Rudy Giuliani in exchange for information on the Bidens, he provided none because there is none. The only information ever pushed on the Bidens in Ukraine has come from one source and one source only, Russia and Russian agents. The impeachment proceedings that bring us here now are predicated on false information spread by the Kremlin. Everyone involved knew they were sharing lies from Trump and Giuliani shadow diplomacy, through my missions to Ukraine and elsewhere, to members of a Bill T team, a group convened for the sole purpose of investigating and damaging the Bidens. (38:53) Everything was for the ultimate benefit of Donald Trump and thereby Vladimir Putin. Because the team's investigations were centered around Biden and Ukraine, I was designated the point person in every matter they pursued. That is how I know with certainty that these Biden stories are untrue then and are untrue now. Congressman Pete Sessions, then Congressman Devin Nunez, Senator Ron Johnson and many others understood they were pushing a false narrative. The same goes for John Solomon, Sean Hannity and media personnel, particularly at Fox News, who used this narrative to manipulate the public ahead of the 2020 elections. Sadly, they're still doing this today as we approach the 2024 elections. (39:37) We cannot separate this conspiracy from the Russian Ukraine war because Trump has no intention to keep aiding Ukraine. Without the support of the United States and NATO, millions in Ukraine will suffer and die. If we allow Russia to defeat Ukraine, eventually, that suffering will reach American shores. Today, I admit my own wrongdoings. I have been a convicted federal election campaign and fraud crimes and served my sentence. I do not hide that from reality. It is part of my truth. Despite rigorous attempts by those in power to silence me, I will be silenced no longer. Thank you to the committee for allowing me to speak. I look forward to answering any and all of your questions.
Mr. Comer (40:19): Thank you. Chair now recognizes Mr. Galanis for his opening statement.
Mr. Galanis (40:26): Chairman Comer, Ranking Member Raskin and members of the committee, my name's Jason Galanis. I was a business partner of Hunter Biden and Devon Archer among others. During the years of 2014 and 2015, our business included the acquisition of 85-year-old Wall Street firm Burnham and Company, the one and a half billion dollar surviving division of Drexel Burnham Lambert. Our objective was to build a diversified private equity platform, which would be anchored by globally known Wall Street brand, together with a globally known political name, Biden. Our goal, that is Hunter Biden, Devon Archer and me, was to make billions not millions. The entire value add of Hunter Biden to our business was his family name and his access to his father, Vice President Joe Biden. In 2014, we believe that the burden of enterprise will be significantly enhanced by forming a partnership with Harvest Fund Management, a $300 billion Chinese financial service company closely connected to the Chinese Communist Party. This effort was led by Hunter Biden's contact with Henry Zhao, the Harvest Chairman. Mr. Zhao was interested in this partnership because of the game changing value add of the Biden family, including Joe Biden who was to be a member of the Burnham Harvest team post vice presidency. My lawyers provided the committee a draft of an email dated August 23rd, 2014, drafted for Hunter Biden that reflects this understanding. It states and I quote, "Michael, please also remind Henry Zhao of our conversation about a board seat for a certain relation of mine. Devin and I golfed with that relation earlier this week and we discussed this very idea and as always, he remains very, very keen on the opportunity." (42:17) I'm certain that this phrase, a certain relation of mine refers to Vice President Biden. Devin told me about this golf course conversation shortly after it happened. Ultimately, this paragraph was deleted from the final version with Hunter following our general rule of thumb on business deals, say it, forget it, write it, regret it. Further to that, I recall being with Hunter Biden and Devin Archer at the Peninsula Bar in New York where Hunter took a call from his father and told him things were going well with Henry Zhao at Harvest and that he might need a little help getting across the finish line. It was not the only time I heard Hunter speak with his father for business reasons. I was present when Hunter called his father on May 4th, 2014 on a cell phone, put it on speaker mode to have him say hello to Yelena Baturina, a Russian oligarch and an investor in Rosemont projects and her husband Yury Luzhkov, the former mayor of Moscow, Deb Archer was also there. (43:16) Hunter said, "Well, I'm here with our friends. I told you we're coming to town and we wanted to say hello." The vice president said hello, some pleasantries, and that I hope you had safe travels and then said, "Okay, you be good to my boy." Hunter responded by saying, "Everything is good and we're moving ahead." The vice president said something about, "Being helpful," and Hunter ended the call by saying he was going to call his father later. Before this call, Hunter sat next to Yelena Baturina at the table and I heard him speaking on business matters generally. A few days after this May 4th party, an email my lawyer provided to this committee shows that Devin had confirmed Ms. Baturina was committed to a "hard order" of 10 to $20 million in a burden investment banking client. (44:04) In an effort to build this financial platform, I engaged in unlawful conduct. Our companies were entrusted with $11 billion of union pension fund money whose trust I betrayed. I pleaded guilty. I've had eight years in federal custody to reflect on my actions. I'm profoundly sorry for committing these crimes. I deserve the lengthy sentence I've received. Nevertheless, as I set out more fully in my full statement, I believe the SBNY prosecutors did not indict Hunter Biden on the same deal for political reasons despite then available documentation that we were partners, were involved in decision-making that involved illegal self-dealing and all of us had financially benefited from these schemes. (44:48) In fact, Hunter Biden and Devin Archer's company Rosemont Seneca Bohai received $15 million from the tribal bonds fraudulent scheme to be invested in the Burnham Group. I've offered slightest information to the government about Hunter Biden's crimes, but the prosecutors have been uninterested and my request for commutation I filed in the DOJ in December 2020 did provide information about Hunter's culpability. The DOJ has retaliated against me and vigorously objected to my being placed in home confined pursuant to the CARES Act. I applied for home confinement on February 4th, 2023 and I was approved on June 9th. On June 12th, this committee issued a subpoena for Devin Archer and the BOP reversed my approval on June 13th with the SDNY prosecutor strongly objecting to my release. I've been appealing this reversal and with each stage, the BOP reason for my denial has changed. (45:42) During the period beginning in January 2023, I was sexually assaulted by a member of the prison staff at FPC Pensacola. He persisted in sexually harassing me for many months thereafter, I had hoped to receive home confinement which removed me from danger. My judgment was clotted by the shame I felt for not being able to prevent the attacks. I was well aware as inmates, all inmates are that the Bureau of Prisons had a horrible record on these matters. I believed my disclosure would've made things worse for me. Unfortunately, the sexual harassment continued until early August when the Prison Correctional Officer's comments became more threatening. I feared for my safety. I decided to seek counseling from Chaplain Dixon the next day on August 10th, 2023. (46:32) The chaplain was visibly upset by the events and asked to bring in Warden Salisbury who quickly opened a PREA investigation, which is a reference to the Prison Rape Elimination Act passed by Congress. After further debriefings, I was immediately escorted to a vehicle and driven by senior staff hours to FPC Montgomery, a separate facility. I'm grateful the committee has opened up an investigation of these matters and I appreciate Chairman Jordan and Comer and subcommittee Chairman [inaudible 00:47:02] signing the letter. I believe I've been a victim of a pattern of retribution by the Department of Justice. I believe I'm putting myself at grave risk within the BOP for providing information on these matters concerning the president and his son. I've been treating professionally at Montgomery. I want to thank case manager coordinator Anthony Barnes and the Warden Randy Keys for the help of facilitating access to my attorney prior to this interview.
Mr. Comer (47:30): Thank you, Mr. Galanis and I want to thank all the witnesses again for being here today. We will now begin the questions and I want to remind members on both sides of the aisle, each member has five minutes. I'm going to adhere to that and hit the gavel. If the question has been asked, then we'll allow the witnesses time to respond, but we are going to try to get in a lot of questions from a lot of members and I will begin the questioning followed by ranking member Raskin. (48:03) Again, Mr. Bobulinski, thank you for your service to our country, your military service. Appreciate you being here. During the 118th Congress, this committee is investigating Joe Biden's involvement and his family's influence peddling schemes around the world. So let's start with that. Mr. Bobulinski, was Joe Biden involved with any of your business dealings with Hunter Biden and James Biden?
Mr. Bobulinski (48:23): Yes, he was.
Mr. Comer (48:25): Was Joe Biden involved in his family's attempts to sell their access to him?
Mr. Bobulinski (48:37): Yes, he was.
Mr. Comer (48:37): You set out to form a legitimate business with the Bidens. Did you come to find out that the Biden family had no interest in doing real business?
Mr. Bobulinski (48:44): I did.
Mr. Comer (48:46): Mr. Galanis, are you aware of any times Hunter Biden used Joe Biden with Joe Biden's knowledge to benefit their business associates?
Mr. Galanis (48:58): Yes.
Mr. Comer (48:58): Which business associates?
Mr. Galanis (49:03): Yelena Baturina, Russian oligarch.
Mr. Comer (49:05): Russian.
Mr. Galanis (49:07): Russian. Chinese. Chinese fund manager, Henry Zhao and Mykola Zlochevsky, a Ukrainian oligarch, oil and gas oligarch.
Mr. Comer (49:20): Okay. Now that we've established that Joe Biden was involved in his family's business dealings, I'd like to turn to the financial records we've subpoenaed. One major point my democrat colleagues downplay is how much money the Biden's accumulated from foreign business ventures in such a short period of time. We have over $24 million to the Biden family and their business associates from 2014 while Joe Biden was vice president, to 2019. Mr. Bobulinski, there came a time when you were attempting to raise $10 million from the Chinese to pursue an actual business deal. A real business deal, but it wouldn't be correct to say this was a $10 million deal, would it? What did the Bidens conceive of the business with the Chinese becoming?
Mr. Bobulinski (50:03): The Chinese were committing to deploying billions of dollars in infrastructure projects here in the United States as well as around the world.
Mr. Comer (50:13): Mr. Galanis, what was the financial goal you, Mr. Archer and Hunter Biden set out to achieve? Was it millions of dollars or billions of dollars?
Mr. Galanis (50:21): Billions of dollars, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Comer (50:24): Billions with a B?
Mr. Galanis (50:25): Yes. Billions.
Mr. Comer (50:27): Now I'd like to turn to some of the statements Joe Biden has made during his presidency about the findings of this investigation. Mr. Bobulinski, Joe Biden has said he never interacted with his family's business associates. Did he meet with you?
Mr. Bobulinski (50:41): He did.
Mr. Comer (50:42): In fact, are you aware that Joe Biden also met with-
Mr. Bobulinski (50:47): I'm sorry, Mr. Chairman. He did multiple times.
Mr. Comer (50:50): Okay. Are you aware that Joe Biden also met with Rob Walker, Eric Sherwin and Devin Archer too?
Mr. Bobulinski (50:56): I'm generally aware of it.
Mr. Comer (51:00): Mr. Galanis, as you discussed earlier, regarding Yelena Baturina, the Russian oligarch, you were present for Hunter Biden calling his then vice president father with the Russian oligarch, Yelena Baturina present, correct?
Mr. Galanis (51:15): That's correct.
Mr. Comer (51:19): You also were present for Hunter Biden's conversation with his father about a board seat on a Chinese company board, is that correct?
Mr. Galanis (51:28): I was present for a call when Chinese transactions discussed. Yes.
Mr. Comer (51:33): So Mr. Galanis, isn't it true that when Joe Biden said he didn't interact with his family's business associates, that's not true, is it?
Mr. Galanis (51:43): I believe it will be misleading to the point of being a non-truth.
Mr. Comer (51:49): I want to touch on the fact about the absent seat in the middle. Hunter Biden has chosen not to attend today's proceedings. I've given Mr. Biden exactly what he asked for before his deposition. It's clear that Hunter Biden knows his testimony would not withstand public scrutiny. Joe Biden has not been truthful about his participation in schemes to sell access and influence, and today's witnesses will show the American people a side of the story that the president and his allies on this side of the aisle are eager to hide. Mr. Bobulinski, can you tell us about your meeting at the Beverly Hilton with Joe Biden?
Mr. Bobulinski (52:26): The short version or long version?
Mr. Comer (52:28): Long version. Within a minute.
Mr. Bobulinski (52:31): Okay. So Hunter Biden, Jim Biden and Joe Biden were in Los Angeles for a variety of business discussions. Joe was there to speak at the Milken Conference in May of 2017. I had lunch with Hunter Biden at the Chateau Marmont and he had asked me to meet with his father that night. (52:50) He set up a meeting at the Beverly Hilton where they hold the Milken Conference and I got there a bit early and sat with Jim Biden, Hunter Biden and were just talking about what we were doing with the Chinese and the legal documents I was working through and they had coached me before Joe showed up to, listen, we're going to just keep things at a very high level. We're not going to go into a lot of details in this meeting. And I just remember that discussion generally because it just struck me as odd, honestly. Joe wasn't in the White House then and that they were framing it that way and then Joe showed up, walked through the lobby of the Beverly Hilton Hotel. I stood up to shake his hand and we sat down and spent 45 minutes to an hour going through my background.
Mr. Comer (53:38): You met with him that long?
Mr. Bobulinski (53:40): Yes, yes, yes. This wasn't a handshake, a two-second discussion about the weather. This was a 45 minute how long, long meeting to an hour where we talked about a lot of stuff.
Mr. Comer (53:50): Very good. Thank you. Chair now recognizes Ranking Member Raskin for his questions,
Mr. Raskin (53:55): But we're actually going to go to Mr. Garcia to begin.
Mr. Garcia (53:58): Great. Thank you very much and thank you again. I just want to just for the record, be very clear that in Mr. Bobulinski's testimony, he has provided zero evidence, zero evidence of any link between Hunter Biden and the President as far as it relates to the business dealings. And so once again, we're back to a hearing where no evidence has been provided of any sort of wrongdoing by the president, but I want to go back-
Mr. Bobulinski (54:19): That's a blatant lie.
Mr. Garcia (54:20): Actually, it's my time, sir. Mr. Bobulinski, I want to go back to the private deposition that we had. I was one of a handful of Democrats in that private, on the record under oath conversation we had and during that deposition, I asked you a question of which you gave a false answer to, and I want to go back to that. I asked you specifically, who got you into the presidential debate that was attended by you and others, and that of course, was a huge moment in that campaign and you could not recall. In fact, you said, "I do not recall who got me into the debate." Do you remember telling me that, sir?
Mr. Bobulinski (54:58): You were playing semantics trying to ask me as if somebody called me directly and gave me a ticket like I-
Mr. Garcia (55:05): Sir. Sir. I asked you.
Mr. Bobulinski (55:06): I told you that my lawyer-
Mr. Garcia (55:07): I'm going to reclaim my time, sir. I'm going to reclaim my time. What I said was-
Mr. Bobulinski (55:10): You just asked me a question, Mr. Garcia.
Mr. Garcia (55:11): I'm reclaiming my time. Thank you, sir. Actually, what I asked you was do you recall who actually got you into the presidential debate? You actually said, "I do not recall who got me into the debate." You did not remember who got you into the debate between Joe Biden and Donald Trump. Of course-
Mr. Bobulinski (55:29): That's not a true statement.
Mr. Garcia (55:30): Sir, you quoted I don't recall who got me into the debate. It's on page 102 of the transcript.
Mr. Bobulinski (55:36): You did not ask me whether I was a guest of Biden or-
Mr. Garcia (55:37): Sir, I asked you that question. Thank you, I'll reclaim my time. I'm not asking you a question right now. Thank you very much, sir. In fact, here as was shown by ranking member Raskin, we know that you were in the debate actually sitting adjacent and next to Trump officials. When we were confronted again on the same question, Mr. Bobulinski, if you were a guest of Mr. Trump's at the debate, you responded and you quoted, once the Wall Street Journal called you out, "Is the Wall Street Journal god or something? Like you act like this is some encyclopedia of fact." And you refuse to still confirm that you were a guest of Donald Trump. So I want to ask you one more time, sir, were you a guest of Donald Trump at the presidential debate?
Mr. Bobulinski (56:17): Mr. Garcia, those were not the questions you asked me in my transcribed interview.
Mr. Garcia (56:20): Wow.
Mr. Bobulinski (56:21): You were trying to ask semantical questions-
Mr. Garcia (56:23): Answer the question, sir, were you a guest of Donald Trump?
Mr. Bobulinski (56:25): I was clearly a guest of Donald Trump at the gate or at the debate.
Mr. Garcia (56:28): You were?
Mr. Bobulinski (56:28): That was obvious to everyone in the world at that point.
Mr. Garcia (56:30): It's interesting-
Mr. Bobulinski (56:31): You were asking me semantical questions.
Mr. Garcia (56:32): Thank you, sir. So you were a guest? You answered the question because at the time, you said in the transcript under oath, "I don't recall who got me into the debate." So just to be clear. So I want to keep going. So you also call yourself, you're not a political person. Yet you went to a presidential debate on behalf of Donald Trump. I also want to also make it clear that you made numerous claims and allegations. You've made them today, you've made them before, and yet, even though you're not a political person, this is also another photo of you. You actually chose to show up at a press conference for Donald Trump prior to the debate because you are not a political person. Did you show up to a press conference for Donald Trump before the debate?
Mr. Bobulinski (57:12): I can't qualify whether it was for Donald Trump.
Mr. Garcia (57:15): Do you know who invited you? Sir, who invited you to the debate? Donald Trump, you said. Who invited you to the press conference?
Mr. Bobulinski (57:22): Who invited me? My lawyers coordinated things and I showed up at a press-
Mr. Garcia (57:26): Well, sir, I will tell you, it was Jason Miller. It's been very clear. It's been reported who actually worked on the part of the Donald Trump campaign. Here you are at a Donald Trump press conference and you can't remember how you got to the press conference. You refuse to answer how you actually got into the Donald Trump debate with Joe Biden. Do you remember speaking at the press conference?
Mr. Bobulinski (57:48): I do. Very clearly.
Mr. Garcia (57:51): You do? Do you know who Jason Miller is, sir?
Mr. Bobulinski (57:53): I do know of him, yes.
Mr. Garcia (57:55): Do you know that he was a Trump campaign staffer?
Mr. Bobulinski (57:57): Mr. Garcia, you keep asking me semantical questions. You underestimate that I had three lawyers around me that we're coordinating my travel, where I was going and stuff like that. So please stop.
Mr. Garcia (58:08): Well, I'll reclaim my time. Thank you very much. It's interesting, sir, because you show up to a pre-debate press conference. You show up to a presidential debate, both invited to by a person running for the presidency of the United States. You know the stakes are high, yet you have no idea how you got to the press conference. You don't remember how you got to the debate and here you are speaking at a press conference of which the national media... So how did you get to the press conference?
Mr. Bobulinski (58:36): I flew on a plane.
Mr. Garcia (58:37): Who invited you?
Mr. Bobulinski (58:39): Are we going in circles?
Mr. Garcia (58:40): Sir, who invited you to the press conference?
Mr. Bobulinski (58:43): My lawyers told me I was invited to come to Tennessee. At that point, I was trying to get the truth and the facts out to the American people. At that moment in time, if I recall, I believe 80 million people watched that debate and that was probably the-
Mr. Garcia (58:57): Thank you, sir. I reclaim my time. Well with that, I think it's very clear for someone that can't remember how I got to a Donald Trump press conference or a Donald Trump debate, you're completely an uncredible witness, sir. Thank you. And I yield back.
Mr. Comer (59:07): Gentleman's time has expired. Chair now recognize the Chairman of the House Ways and Means committee Jason Smith for five minutes.
Mr. Smith (59:13): Thank you Mr. Chairman. We've previously heard from two IRS whistleblowers that Joe Biden was the brand being sold by his family members. One such example of this could be seen in a June 6th, 2017 WhatsApp message where Hunter Biden told a business associate that he was not willing to "sign over my family's brand" or give them, "the keys to my family's only asset." Mr. Bobulinski, can you confirm that President Biden is the brand being sold by his family members?
Mr. Bobulinski (59:53): I can 100% [inaudible 00:59:56].
Mr. Smith (59:56): Thank you. During his deposition, Hunter Biden repeatedly testified under oath that his father was not involved in his business in any capacity and that there wasn't even a connection between his father and his businesses. Here is just one example, "I just state for the record one more time under oath and under penalty of perjury, my father has never been involved in my business. I have never asked my father to be involved in my business. My father has never benefited from my business and I have never asked anyone or my father to do anything for the benefit of anyone I've ever done business for." (01:00:40) Yet the Ways and Means Committee released a WhatsApp message that were provided by the IRS whistleblowers showing that Hunter Biden wrote on July 30th, 27, "I'm sitting here with my father and we would like to understand why the commitment made has not been fulfilled." I'm sitting here waiting for the call with my father. Moreover, you testified that Hunter was not shy about his ability to get his father on the phone and Devin Archer testified that there were multiple instances in which Hunter placed his dad on speakerphone. Mr. Bobulinski, was Hunter Biden telling the truth when he testified under oath that his father was never involved in any of his business dealings?
Mr. Bobulinski (01:01:29): No, he was not. Those are all blatant lies.
Mr. Smith (01:01:32): We continue to hear claims that President Biden was not involved in his family's business dealings and that he did not benefit from illicit business deals. However, IRS special agent Joe Ziglar provided documents to the ways and means Committee, 327 emails, many of which involve Hunter Biden and Hunter Biden's Business Associates. Mr. Bobulinski, do you have any personal experience that leads you to believe that Joe Biden was involved with Hunter Biden's business associates and business dealings?
Mr. Bobulinski (01:02:12): Yes, I do.
Mr. Smith (01:02:14): You want to say a few?
Mr. Bobulinski (01:02:17): To outline how Joe was involved?
Mr. Smith (01:02:18): Yeah.
Mr. Bobulinski (01:02:19): Yes. Different congressmen and women keep trying to say that there's no evidence and use the word involved, which is a very opaque language. If Joe Biden was not involved in his son's business dealings, why after flying all the way across the country to the Milken Conference, where there is next to Davos is probably the biggest conference in the world. Why would he take 45 minutes out of his night? It wasn't a 10:00 AM meeting, it was 10:40 in the evening. He's an elderly man, flew all the way across the country to sit with me for 45 minutes to an hour to discuss my background. The business we are doing with the Chinese, his family's background.
Mr. Smith (01:03:00): Speaking of the business with the Chinese, in October 2020, Joe Biden asserted that his family had not earned money through business dealings in China. However, IRS whistleblowers shared evidence that the Biden family made at least $1.1 million from their business with China, including $100,000 in payment from CFC China Energy and a $1 million payment in exchange for legal services that were never provided to a CFC official, Patrick Ho. Mr. Bobulinski, do you know whether the Biden family made any money from China?
Mr. Bobulinski (01:03:38): They did. Millions of dollars, I think approximately to 8-9 million.
Mr. Smith (01:03:42): The Biden family has made millions of dollars from China, correct?
Mr. Bobulinski (01:03:46): Correct.
Mr. Smith (01:03:47): And you said at least 9 million?
Mr. Bobulinski (01:03:50): Yeah. I think it's actually over 10 million, but I'll leave those details up to you guys.
Mr. Smith (01:03:55): Thank you. I yield back.
Mr. Comer (01:03:57): Gentlemen, yields back. Chair now recognizes the ranking member.
Mr. Raskin (01:04:01): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you Mr. Parnas for being here today. Your involvement with the real Russian hoax about Joe Biden began in 2018 when, as a big donor and a big supporter of Donald Trump's, you were introduced to Rudy Giuliani and you began working with him to dig up dirt on Joe Biden and Ukraine. If you can just tell us quickly how you got involved in that.
Mr. Parnas (01:04:26): Yes. I was a donor at the time. I became doing business with Rudy Giuliani. He got involved in a business I was doing called Fraud Guarantee and in the midst, we started spending a lot of time together until eventually in November of 2018, he approached me and asked me about my connections in Ukraine. After telling him about people that I knew and things that I heard, at that point then, he wanted me to go to Ukraine to find Viktor Shokin, the Prosecutor General.
Mr. Raskin (01:04:54): And basically, he wanted to go from his Fraud Guarantee to Guaranteeing of Fraud on the American people. But after turning over every stone and going down every rabbit hole, including interviewing Viktor Shokin and Zlochevsky the owner of Burisma. Did you ever find the smoking gun or any evidence that Donald Trump was looking for to paste on Joe Biden?
Mr. Parnas (01:05:17): On the contrary, Representative Raskin. Not only did we keep hitting that walls and not finding the smoking gun, but we kept running into sources of the informations that was coming out of Russia.
Mr. Raskin (01:05:30): In fact, Joe Biden was part of a global campaign including by the United States, to oppose corruption and to go after the corrupt forces in Ukraine. Isn't that right?
Mr. Parnas (01:05:40): Yes, sir.
Mr. Raskin (01:05:41): At what point did the campaign to dig up dirt on Biden become a campaign to spread disinformation and lies about Biden?
Mr. Parnas (01:05:50): At some point, when we hit a few brick walls, all of a sudden then I saw the shift between the BLT group, which included John Solomon, the media personality, and Rudy Giuliani and other Trump lawyers to start trying to push narratives that were not validated. We had no way to validate them. Basically, a letter would come over from somebody in Ukraine. I'd hand it over to John Solomon. Next thing you knew, he was on Fox TV two hours later with Sean Hannity.
Mr. Raskin (01:06:24): At what point did Mr. Giuliani begin working directly with Russian agents and Russian assets, individuals who would later become sanctioned by Donald Trump's own treasury department for spreading propaganda and disinformation against Joe Biden?
Mr. Parnas (01:06:41): It was sometime in probably around May, June of 2019.
Mr. Raskin (01:06:46): Were you aware, was Mr. Giuliani aware that these people were basically just doing the bidding of Vladimir Putin?
Mr. Parnas (01:06:52): Absolutely.
Mr. Raskin (01:06:54): So he had no hesitation about spreading lies that were concocted by Russian agents?
Mr. Parnas (01:07:00): As long as it fit the narrative, absolutely not.
Mr. Raskin (01:07:04): How were you and Giuliani able to take these false allegations pedaled by corrupt officials and Russian agents and promote and amplify them here in the United States? In our political system? Weren't media groups skeptical of your claims?
Mr. Parnas (01:07:18): Most media groups. I'd probably say all except for Fox and a few other right-wing media groups didn't want to take any of the information and that aggravated Rudy Giuliani and John Solomon and other players. And the main group that was being pushed through was Fox, Sean Hannity and some other media personnel out there. But then there was also other people that were doing the bidding for the Russian people in Congress like Senator Ron Johnson, like Congressman Pete Sessions that sits here right now. That was with me from the very beginning in this journey into finding of digging dirt on Joe Biden.
Mr. Raskin (01:07:54): Is Putin's war on Ukraine today, which has cost hundreds of thousands of people's lives, is that part
Mr Raskin (01:08:00): Of the vaunted, Russia hoax. Russia hoax.
Mr Parnas (01:08:03): Absolutely not.
Mr Raskin (01:08:04): Is it real?
Mr Parnas (01:08:05): Yes, absolutely.
Mr Raskin (01:08:08): I want to ask you a more personal question, if I might, Mr. Parnas because in my several years living through this extraordinary period of American history, I've tried to ask people like Michael Cohen and Cassidy Hutchinson, I've wondered about people like General Milley, General Kelly. Why did you break with all of the deceit and corruption and lies of Donald Trump? How did you get out of that culture?
Mr Parnas (01:08:34): I mean, it was very difficult. I actually had to head the brick wall myself and get arrested and to be able to get out of that cult, because when you're in that cult, when you are around them, you have blinders on and you're only able to see a certain amount of information, you're only able to hear the certain amount of information, you're not allowed to go out of the outside, out of the circle, and if you go outside of the circle, then you are not in the circle. So eventually, you brainwash yourself to believing certain things that are not true. When I was arrested and had some time to reflect and really understand what was going on, I started realizing, looking back and thinking back to moments in time of where I started thinking myself that this can't be true and we were doing something wrong.
Mr Raskin (01:09:16): Well, thank you for telling the truth and helping America to end this nightmare. I yield back to you Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:09:20): Chair now recognizes the Chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, Jim Jordan.
Jim Jordan (01:09:24): Thank you Mr. Chairman. The ranking member just said that, quote, "Joe Biden was opposed to corruption." Really? So opposed he leveraged a billion dollars of American tax money to fire the prosecutor in Ukraine who was investigating Zolachevsky at Burisma, the company Hunter Biden sat on the board of? Wow. And the prosecutor who replaced Shokin, that Mr. Parnas referenced in his opening statement, Mr. Lutsenko, guess what he did? He took Zolachevsky off the wanted list and dropped the charges. Wow. He's really, really opposed to corruption there. Mr. Bobulinski who's the big guy?
Mr Bobulinski (01:10:02): Joe Biden.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:10:03): Are you sure about that? Because when...
Mr Bobulinski (01:10:05): Joe Biden.
Jim Jordan (01:10:06): You're sure?
Mr Bobulinski (01:10:07): I'm a thousand percent sure.
Jim Jordan (01:10:09): Because when Hunter Biden did his deposition under oath, he said, "I don't know who it is," Even though he was copied on an email that said H will hold 10% for the big guy. You sure the big guy is Joe Biden?
Mr Bobulinski (01:10:20): A thousand percent. And there's other text messages that back that up that the brave whistleblowers, Shapley and Ziegler have produced. Not from my phones, not from my BlackBerry that I took screenshots from, they took them from subpoenas directly from Apple's iCloud that back up the fact that Hunter knew the big guy was Joe Biden, as did everyone.
Jim Jordan (01:10:40): The guy is the brand, the big guy is the lift, the big guy is the one who showed up at golf outings, who took phone calls and meetings and lunches and dinners with Hunter Biden and his business associates. Is that right?
Mr Bobulinski (01:10:50): Correct.
Jim Jordan (01:10:51): Mr. Galanis, you referenced in your opening statement, May 4th, 2014, you were at a party at a restaurant in Brooklyn, New York. Can you tell me who else was there?
Mr Galanis (01:11:06): Yeah, it was a birthday party, so there were more than a hundred people there, but amongst them was Devon Archer, myself, the host, Alex Kloarski, Yelena Baturina, her husband, and then Hunter Biden joined after I arrived.
Jim Jordan (01:11:24): I think you referenced a phone call that took place. Tell the committee what happened with that phone call. Who was involved in that phone call?
Mr Galanis (01:11:34): As I testified in my opening statement, it was Yelena Baturina, her husband, myself, Hunter initiating it, Joe Biden on the speakerphone and Devon Archer.
Jim Jordan (01:11:47): So there was a little pull aside where that group of people you just described were pulled aside and Hunter Biden called his fathers or called the vice president. Is that accurate?
Mr Galanis (01:11:56): That's accurate.
Jim Jordan (01:11:57): And then tell me what was discussed on the call.
Mr Galanis (01:12:02): Discussion I testified was it was a relatively short discussion, but it was a discussion about their galena and Yuri coming to town, as I testified specifically, they talked about being good to his boy and it was ended...
Jim Jordan (01:12:22): Well let ask you this. Let me ask you this. Mr Galanis, let me ask you this. Did you get the impression Joe Biden was expecting the call?
Mr Galanis (01:12:31): Yes, to me it was clearly set up ahead of time. It was an arranged call.
Jim Jordan (01:12:34): So this was arranged, this was coordinated. Hunter Biden calls his father, then vice president, and I think in your deposition you said he said this, "I'm here with our friends that I told you were coming to town," So it's our friends and I told you this was going to happen, which suggests that it was most definitely coordinated. Is that accurate?
Mr Galanis (01:12:55): That's accurate, yes.
Jim Jordan (01:12:56): And again, can you tell the committee who Ms. Baturina is again?
Mr Galanis (01:13:02): A Russian billionaire, wife of the former mayor of Moscow served for near 20 years as the mayor and...
Jim Jordan (01:13:11): She's the wealthiest woman in Russia. She'd already given money to Hunter Biden and his business before this meeting in May, and then subsequent to that meeting, she committed to give more money. Is that accurate?
Mr Galanis (01:13:25): That's accurate.
Jim Jordan (01:13:26): So subsequent to the coordinated call, the arranged call that Hunter Biden had with the vice president of the United States, the wealthiest woman in Russia commits to give millions of dollars more to Hunter Biden's business. Is that all accurate?
Mr Galanis (01:13:39): That is accurate, yes.
Jim Jordan (01:13:41): And again, this was a pull aside done at this meeting and you know that it was coordinated. Is this what they call access to the brand, access to the Biden lift? Is that what you would describe it as, Mr Galanis?
Mr Galanis (01:13:56): I don't think there's any doubt that that was the intent of the call and the objective. Yes.
Jim Jordan (01:14:03): And it followed the motto, it followed the statement that you all agreed to, say it, forget it, write it, regret it. This wasn't put in writing, this was a phone call on a speaker that was... There's no writing about this. It was all done that way. That was how the business operated. Is that correct Mr. Galanis?
Mr Galanis (01:14:24): Yes.
Jim Jordan (01:14:25): I yield back.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:14:25): The gentleman yields back chair now recognizes Mr. Lynch from Massachusetts for five minutes.
Mr Lynch (01:14:34): Thank you Mr. Chairman. I want to make an observation here. I've been on this investigating committee for over 20 years and as an attorney, before that I've had sufficient training and experience to say that with high confidence that when you review the entire record of evidence of these hearings going back over a year, you've actually provided more evidence to impeach Donald Trump for a third time than you have in so much as laying a glove on President Biden. We keep on hearing about the Biden family. When you hear someone say the Biden family, that translates into, "We have no evidence on the President, so we're going to use the Biden family to try to implicate President Biden." But by the constant bumbling and continually shifting arguments here, you've done nothing more than exonerate President Biden. We heard, initially, for months we heard about the Hunter Biden laptop and there were absolutely some embarrassing photos on that and some awful information about Hunter Biden's personal life. I will admit that. Then you bring in your own witnesses, your legal experts before this committee and have them testify and what they said was amazing. (01:15:57) They said there was no evidence to even suggest that there was support for articles of impeachment against the president. That was your legal experts, the Republican legal experts that said that. Then we have statements by Mr. Jordan saying that that Mr. Smirnov was the most corroborating witness that the Republicans had, the strongest witness that they had. And of course, after that, we find out through the Trump-appointed prosecutor that all of the information that Mr. Smirnov had provided was fabricated, false and submitted by the inducement of Russian agents going after President Biden and trying to undermine our democratic system. And now we come to a point where, since that witness blew up, now we are going to prison and we're reaching out to witnesses who have been convicted and sentenced to prison for stealing $80 million from the pensions of innocent workers. We can't get any lower at this point. That's your star witness. I want to remind people, he's sitting in prison, that's why he can't be here today. He's sitting in prison for scamming workers' pensions. (01:17:46) I mean, how low can you get? It's the Republican's idea that this is the best guy they can get to testify against the president. This is the best guy they can get, a guy sitting in prison who can't even be here. Mr Parnas, you've talked about your own direct involvement with Mr. Giuliani and you said that your mission was to dig up dirt on President Biden. Can you talk to us about the coordination between yourself and Mr. Giuliani? Thank you for being here.
Mr Parnas (01:18:22): Thank you, Congressman. So basically it was a shadow diplomacy run by Trump and Giuliani where Giuliani was the shadow diplomacy Secretary of State. I was his right hand and basically the point person in Ukraine to not only dig up, validate, search, whatever needed to be done, to try to find up some corruption against Joe or Hunter Biden to be able to present. Once I would receive whatever information I received, I would then meet with him, John Solomon, other members of the team like Pete Sessions and Derek Harvey or other people there to discuss what we found. At that point, from there, Giuliani would then go to the White House and share with the president, and that was the line of communication.
Mr Lynch (01:19:05): You said also in your testimony that members of this committee, Republican leadership, should have known, should have known before Smirnov was indicted that this information was fabricated about President Biden. Could you talk about that?
Mr Parnas (01:19:21): Congressman Lynch, not that they should have known, they did know. They knew exactly what was going on. They knew that the evidence was not vetted. This information was just coming in from anywhere from left to right field and it was being pushed straight to the halls of Congress without zero verification of it.
Mr Lynch (01:19:37): Okay, thank you. Mr Chairman, my time has expired and I yield back.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:19:42): Gentleman's time's expired. Before I recognize Mr. Palmer, I'd like to enter into the record the testimony of Tony Bobulinski with the committee on February 13th, 2024. It corrects the record of Representative Garcia's who did not provide your entire testimony. On page 147, you told the committee about your understanding of who invited you to the events referenced by Mr. Garcia. So without objection, I'd like to enter into the record the entire transcribed interview of Tony Bobulinski.
Mr Raskin (01:20:13): And Mr. Chairman, I'd like to enter for the record an article from today's Daily Beast entitled, "Texts Reveal More Russia Ties for Key Anti-Biden Witness, Bobulinski."
Chairman Mr Comer (01:20:21): Okay, Daily Beast. Without objection. Chair now recognizes Mr. Palmer from Alabama for five minutes.
Mr PALMER (01:20:28): Mr Bobulinski, I have very limited time and I want to get through a lot of information, so please answer these questions with a yes or no, if you don't mind. You have met Joe Biden, isn't that correct?
Mr Bobulinski (01:20:39): Correct.
Mr PALMER (01:20:40): In fact, you had a meeting with Joe Biden, isn't that correct?
Mr Bobulinski (01:20:43): Two of them.
Mr PALMER (01:20:44): One of those times was before the Milken Conference in Los Angeles, May of 2017. Is that correct?
Mr Bobulinski (01:20:49): It was during the Milken conference.
Mr PALMER (01:20:51): You provided a great deal of documentation to this committee. I want to show you some messages between you and Hunter Biden, it'll be on the screen here in May of 2017 before you first had a meeting with Joe Biden. These are messages between you and Hunter Biden dated May 2nd, 2017. Do you recognize these?
Mr Bobulinski (01:21:08): I do.
Mr PALMER (01:21:09): At the bottom, Hunter wrote, "Dad not in now until 11. Lets me and Jim meet at 10 at Beverly Hilton where he's staying." Jim is James Biden, president Biden's brother. Is that correct?
Mr Bobulinski (01:21:21): Correct.
Mr PALMER (01:21:23): The next set of messages is, if you put those on screen, it's between another business associate of Hunter Biden's and you. His name is James. Do you recognize it?
Mr Bobulinski (01:21:31): I do.
Mr PALMER (01:21:33): At the top you write, "About to meet Hunter Jim and I guess Joe at Beverly Hilton Hotel." Joe is now President Joe Biden, is that correct?
Mr Bobulinski (01:21:41): Correct.
Mr PALMER (01:21:42): This chat between you and Jim Biden, Joe Biden's brother, you write to Jim, "Great to meet you and spend some time together. Please thank Joe for this time. It was great to talk. Thanks, Tony B." You met with Joe Biden, Hunter Biden and Jim Biden the night before the Milken conference in 2017, is that correct?
Mr Bobulinski (01:22:01): I did, and Jim Biden perjured himself by trying to deny that meeting.
Mr PALMER (01:22:04): Thank you, Mr. Bobulinski. That was at the Beverly Hilton, correct?
Mr Bobulinski (01:22:09): Correct.
Mr PALMER (01:22:11): You can provide more details around that meeting. What was the purpose of that meeting?
Mr Bobulinski (01:22:16): I didn't ask for the meeting, so I wish Hunter Biden was sitting next to me and he could under oath describe it, but the only reason why I was meeting with Joe Biden and the only reason why I was there is because I was the CEO of the enterprise that they were putting together with the Chinese company, CFC.
Mr PALMER (01:22:36): So can you give me a little more detail about what was discussed in the meeting?
Mr Bobulinski (01:22:39): Well, as I said earlier, before Joe Biden showed up, Hunter and Jim Biden coached me, asked, set a sort of outline that we wouldn't go into a lot of details. So through the 45 to 60 minute meeting I had with Joe Biden, I think it was about 10:40 PM after he flew across country, we talked about my background, my family's military background, the different business ventures I'd done around the world, the family I worked with. Joe spent time talking about his family, some of the tragedies that they had lived through and at a high level, Hunter actually introduced me to Joe because before Joe came and sat down with us, Hunter said, "Hey, give me five to 10 minutes. I need to read my father in on it."
Mr PALMER (01:23:23): So when you're referencing Joe and Hunter's father, you're referencing President Joe Biden.
Mr Bobulinski (01:23:28): I am.
Mr PALMER (01:23:31): These four images... Well, in this message you sent to James again, you said, "You spent more time with Joe and Jim this morning," And to be factually correct, that's President Joe Biden and James Biden, his brother. "Also saw them last night including Hunter." These four images show a pretty clear record of your meeting with Joe Biden in May of 2017, Mr. Bobulinski. Hunter Biden, during his transcribed interview, testified that the meeting did in fact take place, and after being asked, did Mr. Bobulinski meet with your father during the trip, Hunter stated he met with him in the lobby of the hotel. When asked who attended the meeting, Hunter replied, "My uncle and myself." But when asked whether the meeting at the Beverly Hilton between Joe Biden, Jim Biden, Hunter Biden, and Tony Bobulinski took place, Jim Biden testified, "Absolutely not." These stories don't match up. Mr. Chairman, Jim Biden also told the committee that Joe Biden did not meet the Chinese businessman, Yixing Ming. Rob Walker, known as a friendly witness committee, said the opposite. (01:24:32) So Mr. Chairman, it appears to me that there are material inconsistencies between the witness's testimony. These witnesses statements appear to me to be irreconcilable. In short, Mr. Chairman, someone appears to be lying to the committee. The inconsistent testimony seems to come from Jim Biden, the president's brother. Lying to Congress is a serious offense, Mr. Chairman, a criminal one in fact, and if the Bidens or anyone else has come before this committee and lied to this committee, I strongly encourage the committee to pursue criminal referrals to the Department of Justice. One last thing that I want to ask. Mr. Bobulinski or Mr. Galanis, have either of you heard of any offer of a pardon for anyone involved or associated with or a partner to the Biden Family Enterprise corruption investigation?
Mr Bobulinski (01:25:20): I'm sorry, was the question...
Mr PALMER (01:25:21): Have you heard of anyone being suggested that a pardon might be in order for anyone associated with this enterprise?
Mr Bobulinski (01:25:29): I have not.
Mr PALMER (01:25:30): Thank you Mr. Bobulinski. Thank you Mr. Chairman. Yield back.
Mr Raskin (01:25:33): Mr. Chairman, I just have a parliamentary inquiry. We've heard for months now and seen that the photo of that Blackberry with the cracked screen, does the committee have in its possession the data for Mr. Bobulinski's phone from which he's allegedly taken these pictures? Because I think we need the data that they keep referring to, and maybe Mr. Bobulinski could just turn it over to us or we could subpoena it today.
Jim Jordan (01:25:57): We have the images that we have shared with you.
Mr Raskin (01:25:59): Right. I saw the picture of the cracked Blackberry, but do we have the underlying texts that are being referred to by my friend, Mr. Palmer?
Mr Goldman (01:26:15): Bobulinski previously said he'd be happy to turn over his phone.
Jim Jordan (01:26:18): We have pictures of all the text message and screenshots that we've provided with everyone on the committee.
Mr Raskin (01:26:25): Okay. All right. Well of course he's just given us obviously the ones he's selected. I'm wondering whether we could get all of those texts and I would move to the committee's subpoena Bobulinski's Blackberry phone on which messages with Hunter Biden and the O'Nada Holdings partners are saved. He stated that he's willing to provide it to the committee, so it should be rather simple.
Speaker 2 (01:26:43): Mr. Chairman? Second. I have a motion.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:26:50): Yeah. Okay. There's a motion to subpoena Bobulinski's Blackberry.
Mr Raskin (01:26:55): Yeah, with the texts that were just referenced by Mr. Palmer.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:26:59): Chair recognizes Mr. Jordan.
Jim Jordan (01:27:01): I move the table in motion.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:27:02): There's a motion to table. The motion to table is not debatable. As many are in favor of tabling may signify by saying aye. All those opposed signify by saying, no.
Speaker 2 (01:27:20): No.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:27:21): In the opinion of the chair, the aye's have it and the motion to table is agreed to.
Mr Raskin (01:27:25): Mr. Chairman, what we're doing is we're tabling evidence here, which you keep relying on, so I'm going to ask for recorded vote for that. That just makes no sense.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:27:33): A recorded vote is ordered.
Speaker 2 (01:27:37): We'll suspend for a moment.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:27:39): We'll suspend for a moment. This is a committee hearing. We don't have the clerk. Will somebody go find the clerk?
Speaker 2 (01:27:57): He said it. Did he say under oath in the...
Mr Goldman (01:28:02): Mr. Speaker, Mr. Chairman, Mr. minority leader. Do you think it's possible that the witness would voluntarily just give it?
Mr Raskin (01:28:13): But I had understood actually that Mr. Bobulinski had volunteered when he was asked about this, it would simplify things if he would just turn over the Blackberry.
Mr Goldman (01:28:22): Well, he did very clearly say he's happy to turn over his blackberry to the committee. We then asked for it at the deposition. We've asked the majority to ask...
Chairman Mr Comer (01:28:31): Mr. Goldman, you're out of order. We're in suspension here waiting for the clerk to come so we can take the vote that your side of the aisle requested.
Mr Goldman (01:28:41): You can't make this stuff up.
Speaker 5 (01:28:42): You can't.
Mr Goldman (01:28:44): This is Jurassic Park. Jeez.
Speaker 3 (01:28:55): Mr Ranking member. Mr Ranking member.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:29:01): Yes.
Speaker 3 (01:29:03): I solely Want to underscore the importance of this.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:29:07): I'm sorry, gentlelady's out of order. You can come back here and talk to him if you want.
Speaker 4 (01:29:23): Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:29:30): Yes.
Speaker 4 (01:29:33): We don't even have...
Chairman Mr Comer (01:29:35): I said Ms. Ocasio-Cortez would have to come up. You will as well. Sorry.
Mr Raskin (01:31:50): Mr. Chairman. Just an invitation to regular order. We have democratic clerks who are faithful to the rule of law and could do this if you're waiting for clerks and we'll all be here to document their work. In other words, if you want to conduct the vote with the Democratic clerks, we can do it.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:32:10): A recorded vote is ordered. The clerk will call the roll.
CLERK (01:32:15): Mr. Jordan?
Jim Jordan (01:32:17): Yes.
CLERK (01:32:17): Mr. Jordan votes yes. Mr. Turner? Mr. Gosar? Ms. Fox? Mr. Growthman.
Mr Growthman (01:32:31): Yes.
CLERK (01:32:32): Mr. Growthman votes yes. Mr. Cloud.
Mr Cloud (01:32:36): Yes.
CLERK (01:32:37): Mr. cloud votes yes. Mr. Palmer.
Palmer (01:32:41): Aye.
CLERK (01:32:43): Mr. Palmer votes aye. Mr. Higgins.
Higgins (01:32:48): Yes.
CLERK (01:32:48): Mr. Higgins votes yes. Mr. Sessions.
Sessions (01:32:51): Aye.
CLERK (01:32:53): Mr. sessions votes aye. Mr. Biggs.
Biggs (01:32:57): Aye.
CLERK (01:32:57): Mr. Biggs votes aye. Ms. Mace.
Mace (01:33:00): Aye.
Speaker 2 (01:33:02): Ms. Mace votes Aye. Mr. La Turner.
La Turner (01:33:06): Aye.
CLERK (01:33:08): Mr. La Turner votes aye. Mr. Fallon. Mr. Donalds.
Donalds (01:33:19): Yes.
CLERK (01:33:20): Mr Donalds votes yes. Mr. Perry. Mr. Timmons.
Timmons (01:33:28): Aye.
CLERK (01:33:30): Timmons votes aye. Mr. Burchett. Ms. Green.
Green (01:33:38): Aye.
Speaker 2 (01:33:40): Ms. Green votes aye. Ms. McLean.
McLean (01:33:45): Aye.
CLERK (01:33:45): Ms. McLean votes aye. Ms. Boebert. Mr. Frye.
Frye (01:33:52): Aye.
CLERK (01:33:54): Mr. Frye votes Aye. Ms. Luna. Mr. Langworthy
Langworthy (01:34:01): Aye.
CLERK (01:34:02): Mr. Langworthy votes aye. Mr. Burleson. Mr. Waltz.
Waltz (01:34:11): Aye.
CLERK (01:34:11): Mr. Waltz votes aye. Mr. Raskin.
Mr Raskin (01:34:14): No.
CLERK (01:34:16): Mr. Raskin votes No. Ms. Norton. Mr. Lynch.
Mr Lynch (01:34:19): No.
CLERK (01:34:22): Mr. Lynch votes No. Mr. Connolly
Mr Connolly (01:34:29): Nay.
CLERK (01:34:31): Mr. Connolly votes nay. Mr. Krishna Mothy.
Krishna (01:34:36): No.
CLERK (01:34:38): Mr. Krishna Mothy votes no. Mr. Kana. Mr. Mfume.
Mfume (01:34:45): No.
CLERK (01:34:47): Mr. Mfume votes no. Ms. Ocasio-Cortez.
Ocasio-Cortez (01:34:51): Nay.
CLERK (01:34:53): Ms. Ocasio-Cortez votes nay. Ms. Porter. Ms. Bush. Ms. Brown. Ms. Stansbury. Mr. Garcia.
Garcia (01:35:14): No.
CLERK (01:35:14): Mr. Garcia votes no. Mr. Frost. Ms. Lee.
Lee (01:35:20): No.
CLERK (01:35:22): Ms. Lee votes no. Mr. Kassar.
Kassar (01:35:25): No.
CLERK (01:35:26): Mr. Kassar votes no. Ms. Crockett.
Crockett (01:35:29): No.
CLERK (01:35:31): Ms. Crockett votes no. Mr. Goldman.
Mr Goldman (01:35:35): No.
CLERK (01:35:36): Mr. Goldman votes no. Mr. Moskowitz.
Moskowitz (01:35:40): No.
CLERK (01:35:42): Moskowitz votes no. Ms. Tlaib.
Tlaib (01:35:45): No.
CLERK (01:35:47): Ms. Tlaib votes no. Ms. Presley.
Presley (01:35:52): No.
CLERK (01:35:52): Ms. Presley votes no. Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:35:56): I vote yes, and how is Mr. Burleson recorded.
CLERK (01:36:00): Mr. Chairman votes yes. Mr. Burleson is not recorded.
Burleson (01:36:04): Yes.
CLERK (01:36:06): Mr. Burleson votes yes.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:36:06): How is Ms. Bobert recorded?
CLERK (01:36:10): Ms. Bobert is not recorded.
Bobert (01:36:12): Aye.
CLERK (01:36:14): Ms. Bobert votes aye.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:36:16): How is Mr. Turner recorded?
CLERK (01:36:18): Mr. Turner is not recorded.
Turner (01:36:20): Aye.
CLERK (01:36:22): Mr. Turner votes aye.
Jim Jordan (01:36:24): How is Mr. Frost recorded?
CLERK (01:36:27): Mr. Frost is not recorded.
Frost (01:36:32): No.
CLERK (01:36:32): Mr. Frost votes no.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:36:33): How is Mr. Fallon recorded?
CLERK (01:36:37): Mr. Fallon is not recorded.
Fallon (01:36:39): Aye. Yes.
CLERK (01:36:43): Mr. Fallon votes aye.
Jim Jordan (01:36:45): How's Ms. Porter recorded?
CLERK (01:36:48): Ms. Porter is not recorded.
Porter (01:36:50): No
CLERK (01:36:51): Ms. Porter votes no.
Jim Jordan (01:36:55): Will the clerk tally the report?
Chairman Mr Comer (01:37:05): So who's next? Who do I recognize? We just finished.
CLERK (01:37:17): Mr. Chairman, on this vote, the ayes are 21, the nays are 16.
Chairman Mr Comer (01:37:21): The ayes have it. The motion passes. Chair now recognizes Mr. Connolly for five minutes.
Mr Connolly (01:37:26): Thank you Mr. Chairman. Mr. Bobulinski, in your deposition, you were asked about taking a picture of your phone and you said, and I quote, "I still have that phone. I could put that phone on this table right here. And every person in this room could look at that individual text and validate that it's a legitimate text and the date and time stamp on it." Are you willing to provide the committee voluntarily with the BlackBerry referenced and that phone?
Mr Bobulinski (01:37:53): I'm willing to sit in a room with both the chairman and the ranking member with my phone and their staff, and we can go through each and every text message. As I said in my interview, I had a forensics expert plug into my BlackBerry, somebody who's done extensive work for the FBI for over 10 years with an interest of pulling all the data off that phone so I could provide it to the committee. Unfortunately, they were using Selbright software, which is the software that the FBI uses, and they were unable to pull the data off the phone. So I am more than willing to sit in the room with Mr. Chairman and the ranking member and their staff with that BlackBerry fully charged, and we can go through each and every message if that's helpful.
Mr Connolly (01:38:34): Well, that's some progress and I appreciate that, but you can understand, I'm sure, why the committee wants to look at prima facie evidence on its own.
Mr Bobulinski (01:38:42): Well, I can't understand why you're trying to imply that I didn't cooperating.
Mr Connolly (01:38:46): Mr. Bobulinski, this is my time. You can understand why we would want to look at evidence raw and unvarnished so that we can make our own determination. But thank you for your willingness to cooperate, at least at that level. Mr. Parnas, you observed, back in 2023, in a letter you sent to Chairman Comer that there were flagrant examples of Giuliani interfering in Ukrainian politics, unquote. Why would Giuliani be interfering in another country's politics?
Mr Parnas (01:39:22): I mean, Giuliani would do and say whatever he needed for the purpose of getting the information he wanted to secure Donald Trump's 2020 election. So just a prime example of one of the things he did, he had a close relationship with then a boxer, Vladimir Klitschko, who was then the mayor in Ukraine. When the new president came over, there was rumors about maybe him not staying in office as mayor of Ukraine. Klitschko flew to New York, met with Rudy Giuliani, and then on the meeting that we had with Andrei Yermak in Spain that was relevant, had to do with President Zelensky announcing the investigation into Joe and Hunter Biden. At that meeting, he also brought up the Klitschko situation and basically told Yermak that if Zelensky got rid of Klitschko, president Trump and the American people would be very upset about that because we love him and he needs to be in there.
Mr Connolly (01:40:19): So was Giuliani just doing this as a rogue on his own because he was a patriotic American who loved Donald Trump, or had somebody encouraged him to engage in this kind of political interference in another country?
Mr Parnas (01:40:32): I think he was encouraged by Donald Trump.
Mr Connolly (01:40:36): Personally?
Mr Parnas (01:40:36): Personally, yes.
Mr Connolly (01:40:37): That's your testimony?
Mr Parnas (01:40:38): Yes, sir.
Mr Connolly (01:40:38): Thank you. In your letter, you also said that Mr. Giuliani was to, "Deliver a precise message in very strict words," With respect to the administration of the then newly installed president of Ukraine, president Zelensky. What did you understand a very strict message or a message of very strict words construed, and what was that message that you delivered that was in very strict words?
Mr Parnas (01:41:16): Yes, Congressman. He basically told me not to be nice, to be very stern and relay the message that unless Zelensky announced an investigation into the Bidens by Monday, this was Sunday, that there would be no cooperation, no aid to Ukraine from the United States, and Vice President Pence at the time, that was scheduled to appear for the inauguration, would not appear to the inauguration.
Mr Connolly (01:41:39): That would seem to corroborate that very famous and beautiful telephone conversation between President Trump then and President Zelensky basically saying, "But I need a favor," And stating that there'd be withholding of military aid until that favor was delivered. Is that fair?
Mr Parnas (01:41:58): Oh, absolutely. I was a part of setting
Speaker 6 (01:42:00): ... setting up that phone call, that famous phone call that Trump had with Zelensky.
Speaker 7 (01:42:05): Hmm. I think your testimony is very important, Mr. Parnas, and it's under oath.
Speaker 6 (01:42:12): Yes sir.
Speaker 7 (01:42:12): I thank you. I yield back.
Speaker 8 (01:42:14): Chair now recognizes Ms. Taylor Greene from Georgia for five minutes.
Speaker 9 (01:42:19): Thank you. Mr. Chairman. Joe Biden continues to lie to the American people about his role in his family's businesses. In 2020, he stood up on stage of a presidential debate and told the American people that his family didn't take any money from China. That was a lie. Not only was it a lie, he knew it was a lie. He knew it because he met with his son, Hunter Biden's, Chinese business associates. I want to talk about CEFC, which is the China Energy Fund Committee. Mr. Bobulinski, who is Chairman Ye?
Speaker 10 (01:42:56): Chairman Ye was the chairman of CEFC.
Speaker 9 (01:43:00): Thank you. Jim Biden told the FBI and IRS that Chairman Ye was the protege of Xi Jinping, the leader of China and the Chinese Communist Party. Mr. Bobulinski, Rob Walker told this committee that Joe Biden met Chairman Ye. Are you aware of that? Yes or no?
Speaker 10 (01:43:19): I am now. I wasn't at the time.
Speaker 9 (01:43:23): And Joe Biden also met with you, is that right?
Speaker 10 (01:43:25): Yes, he did. Twice.
Speaker 9 (01:43:28): Who is Director Zhang?
Speaker 10 (01:43:30): Director Zhang was the number two at CEFC.
Speaker 9 (01:43:35): The executive director of CEFC. The number two?
Speaker 10 (01:43:39): Yeah, he was the number two executive, but really the point person that I worked with and the Biden family work with, and he's the individual that Hunter Biden was shaking down at the end of July 2017 demanding that they fund the $10 million. They ultimately sent five but $10 million directly to Hunter Biden's account, Owasco.
Speaker 9 (01:44:00): Thank you Mr. Bobulinski. I wanted to show you a text message that Hunter Biden sent to you and his other business associates. I'm holding it right here. I'll read it to you. "Hey Tony, I have an idea. In light of the fact we are at an impasse of sorts in both James lawyers and my chairman gave an emphatic no, I think we should all meet in Romania." He's speaking about my chairman. When Hunter Biden came in for his deposition, he said that he was referring to Chairman Ye and that the rest of your group referred to Zhang as a different chairman. Does this make any sense to you?
Speaker 10 (01:44:36): That's a lie. I never heard Director Zhang reference as chairman and I had direct communications with Director Zhang over WeChat, met him in Romania, met him in Moscow, met him around the world, in New York, trying to develop this business and he was never referred to as the chairman first of all. Second of all, that makes absolutely no in the context of this message because we are discussing Oneida Holdings LLC. And the Chinese-
Speaker 9 (01:45:04): Thank you. So he was not the chairman, just to clarify, yes or no?
Speaker 10 (01:45:07): Correct.
Speaker 9 (01:45:07): Okay. So I want to show you another text. When he said his chairman, he was talking about his dad. This is from Rob Walker. It didn't seem to make much sense to Rob Walker either. So he said that when Hunter... He said this to you. When Hunter was talking about his chairman, he was talking about his dad. When Rob Walker came in to give his transcribed interview to the committee, he basically said, "Well, Hunter was high or confused or mad." And Rob Walker said that he was just trying to calm things down between you and Hunter. But that doesn't really answer the question about who Hunter Biden is talking about. Hunter Biden lied to this committee. (01:45:49) So here clearly he says Rob Walker saying he is talking about his dad. So I want to be very clear, we've established that Zeng is not the chairman obviously. Is that correct? Yes or no?
Speaker 10 (01:46:02): Correct.
Speaker 9 (01:46:03): Let me show you another message. This message doesn't call Zeng Chairman Zeng, does it. Just says the Chinese want to do business with the Bidens. As a matter of fact, it says both coming to be my partner to be partners with the Bidens with an S. He, Zeng, is implied, has implied that the number one has made it clear and available to him. Who is the number one?
Speaker 10 (01:46:30): The number one is Xi Jinping.
Speaker 9 (01:46:33): Xi Jinping, the president of China, yes or no? The leader of the Communist Party, the CCP, is the number one.
Speaker 10 (01:46:41): Yes. That's the number one that Hunter was referencing in that message.
Speaker 9 (01:46:47): Now let's be very clear, this was in 2017, but I would like to make it known for this committee that Joe Biden told the press in 2016. As a matter of fact, I quote, "Yeah, I am. I am going to run in 2020." He told the press in 2016 that he was running for President of the United States in 2020. So here is the Bidens doing business in China in 2017 when everybody knew he was planning to be President of the United States. Do you see that to be a serious problem, Mr. Bobulinski.
Speaker 10 (01:47:25): I do. And I wish this committee would thoroughly investigate it and focus on all the evidence that the SDNY has on CEFC. They had FISA warrants, so they were recording conversations and I wish they disclosed all that data and fact to this committee.
Speaker 9 (01:47:39): Thank you, Mr. Bobulinski. I yield Mr. Chairman.
Speaker 8 (01:47:42): The Gentlelady yields back. Chair now recognize Mr. Krishnamoorthi for five minutes.
Speaker 11 (01:47:46): Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Parnas, Rudy Giuliani tasked you with quote, "A mission to travel the globe to find dirt to damage the Biden's reputation in the 2018 timeframe." Right?
Speaker 12 (01:47:58): Correct. Yes.
Speaker 11 (01:47:59): And this was in an effort to secure re-election as president in 2020, right?
Speaker 12 (01:48:05): Correct. Yes.
Speaker 11 (01:48:06): And by dirt you mean evidence of wrongdoing or criminality, right?
Speaker 12 (01:48:10): Yes sir.
Speaker 11 (01:48:11): And in your travels you found quote, "Precisely zero proof of the Biden's criminality." Right?
Speaker 12 (01:48:17): Correct.
Speaker 11 (01:48:18): And there was no evidence of the Biden's corruption in Ukraine because as you said, there truly was none, right?
Speaker 12 (01:48:23): Correct. Yes sir.
Speaker 11 (01:48:24): Now, interestingly, you have looked for dirt around the world about the Biden's and specifically Joe Biden in particular, and you say, "The FBI CIA NSA have all failed to produce any evidence of criminal wrongdoing." Right?
Speaker 12 (01:48:37): Correct.
Speaker 11 (01:48:38): Not only that, but former Ukrainian president Petro Poroshenko stated, quote, "There's not a single word of truth to these allegations about Joe Biden." Right?
Speaker 12 (01:48:49): Absolutely. Yes sir.
Speaker 11 (01:48:50): Now there's a guy named Yuriy Lutsenko, who's the former prosecutor general of Ukraine, and he also, confirmed that nothing ties the Bidens to criminal activity in Ukraine, right?
Speaker 12 (01:49:02): Correct.
Speaker 11 (01:49:02): And then there's another prosecutor general named Viktor Shokin who also said he conceded quote, "That he had no evidence that either Joe or Hunter Biden had ever interfered with Ukrainian law." Right?
Speaker 12 (01:49:17): Yes, sir.
Speaker 11 (01:49:17): And the reason you know this is because you talked to each of these people, right?
Speaker 12 (01:49:20): Yes, sir.
Speaker 11 (01:49:21): And your job was to try to dig up dirt or manufacture dirt, right?
Speaker 12 (01:49:26): Yes, sir.
Speaker 11 (01:49:27): And yet we have conducted months of hearings and because there's been no evidence of wrongdoing, you've called this whole impeachment inquiry a, quote, "Wild goose chase." Right?
Speaker 12 (01:49:38): Yes, sir.
Speaker 11 (01:49:39): Now, interestingly, we've heard from the other side that, quote, "The real quid pro quo wasn't Donald Trump, it was Joe Biden when he tried to hold up foreign aid when he was vice president in exchange for firing the federal prosecutor in Ukraine that was investigating the corruption from his son." Now you again looked for evidence to support this claim. There is no evidence, correct?
Speaker 12 (01:50:06): Correct. That was false.
Speaker 11 (01:50:07): In fact, firing the prosecutor would make it more likely that they would go after the company and question, Burisma, not less, right?
Speaker 12 (01:50:18): Well, the ironic part is the reason why majority of the world and Ukraine and the Obama administration wanted to get rid of Victor Shokin because he was corrupt. Not because he was investigating Burisma. Because he was stalling investigations for UK that was looking into a $23 million they wanted to get out from Zlochevsky, and Shokin stalled that investigation.
Speaker 11 (01:50:40): So, the logic is just the opposite of what the majority's claims is to be the case, namely that they say that somehow Joe Biden was out to fire the prosecutor to reduce the chances of a prosecution of Burisma, but actually in firing that prosecutor, he increased the chances in prosecuting Burisma, right?
Speaker 12 (01:51:03): Absolutely correct, yes.
Speaker 11 (01:51:05): So let me just talk to you about what some of the other witnesses in this impeachment inquiry have said. Jonathan Turley, the constitutional expert the Republicans brought forward, said, "There's no evidence of which he was aware to support impeaching the president." You agree with that? Correct?
Speaker 12 (01:51:18): 100%.
Speaker 11 (01:51:19): Garrett Graves, a colleague of ours said just last week, "Have I seen anything that is impeachable? No, I haven't." You agree with that statement as well?
Speaker 12 (01:51:28): Yes sir.
Speaker 11 (01:51:29): Last year, our Republican colleague, Ken Buck, who's about to retire, said that evidence of wrongdoing by President Biden, quote, "Doesn't exist right now. It doesn't exist now. It didn't exist then." Right?
Speaker 12 (01:51:42): That's exactly true, sir.
Speaker 11 (01:51:44): Sir, how many times have you met Donald Trump?
Speaker 12 (01:51:49): Well, over 10 times I'd say. I'd have to count, but lots of times.
Speaker 11 (01:51:53): Is there anything that you'd like to relate to us about your conversations with Donald Trump that would bear on the conduct of these proceedings?
Speaker 12 (01:52:01): I mean, Donald Trump was aware of everything that was going on. On that day in the Red Room when we were in the White House, after Rudy bringing Donald Trump up to speed on that I could go out to Ukraine and get Viktor Shokin. Donald Trump approached me, shook my head, said, "Thank you for all that you're doing, keep up the good work." Patted me on the back, took pictures and I was off to Ukraine.
Speaker 11 (01:52:24): To meet with Viktor Shokin?
Speaker 12 (01:52:25): To find Viktor Shokin to bring him back here to meet with Lindsey Graham.
Speaker 11 (01:52:29): Got it. Thank you so much. I yield back.
Speaker 12 (01:52:31): Thank you.
Speaker 8 (01:52:32): Chair now recognizes Mr. Cloud from Texas for five minutes.
Speaker 13 (01:52:37): Thank you, Chairman. And we have heard time after time, Joe Biden say that he had no knowledge whatsoever about the business dealings, and that changed. He had never allegedly had any conversation with Hunter. Then they moved the ball to say that, well, he didn't have any business dealings, he wasn't involved, didn't have any financial contribution. Since then, we've uncovered about 20 shell companies and we have bank records that bring light to that. And while we can't cover all 20 shell companies in five minutes, I wanted to focus on one. And that is Rosemont Seneca-Bohai. Rosemont Seneca-Bohai is interesting. And Devin Archer had testified, and he said this in his testimony, he said that this entity, quote, "Was used as a common entity, owned 50-50 on a handshake deal between Devin and Hunter splitting these shares." Actually, that was your words, Mr. Galanis. Do you stand by those words? (01:53:43) Yes, I do.
Speaker 12 (01:53:45): And Devin Archer agreed with that. He said Hunter was a corporate secretary of RSB and had a handshake 50-50 ownership deal. Is that correct?
Speaker 13 (01:53:54): That's correct, yes.
Speaker 12 (01:53:55): And primarily, this company was set up to initially as a place to hold equity from equity stake of Bohai Harvest, is that correct?
Speaker 13 (01:54:09): What I was told by the partners at the time, it was set up to do that and invest in other businesses. I think Devin Archer subsequently testified to that effect, and it included monies that were paid from the bond fraud, $15 million that was wired to that RSB account as well. So it conducted multiple transactions as you depicted in that diagram.
Speaker 12 (01:54:32): And even if this were legal and there was no impropriety here, it is very concerning because this company's set up to basically compete against America's energy interest at the behest of CCP. Then we have other flows into Rosemont SenecaBohai from Burisma. We all know about Hunter's $1 million salary that he received for sitting on the board and providing no actual function there. And so we have 1 million salary going through Rosemont-Seneca to Hunter Biden. And then this is interesting, we have a meeting with Kazakhstani Karakashev, and what gets me here is the $300 at the end of the $142,300 that goes into this. And then the next day went to a Porsche dealership for a car for a Hunter Biden. (01:55:24) Now, what's interesting about all this, of course, is that each of these not only flowed money through the Shell companies to Hunter Biden, but each of them also involved important meetings with, of course, President Biden. And so on December 4th, we have coffee with Jonathan Lee, who was one of the members who started Bohai Harvest, and he was connected with the CCP. They were having trouble getting licensed to work because of course the CCP has to get permission for that, until Hunter flew over on Air Force two with Vice President Joe Biden at the time, they met with Jonathan Lee, Hunter introduced him. Joe ended up writing a letter of recommendation to Jonathan Lee's daughter to get into college. And then we see that this relationship continues to be formed. (01:56:18) Of course, in the Ukraine we know that April 16th, 2015, Joe Biden had dinner with a Burisma official at Café Milano. Seemed to be a popular spot. Because Joe Biden also had dinner with [inaudible 01:56:33] there. All in flow to going here. And of course, as Tony Bobulinski has pointed out several times, this all comes down to eventually the one big guy who gets 10% for the big guy. And so we know that all this money flowed through this to get to Hunter. And then we know of course that 10% went to the big guy. So, Mr. Bobulinski, does this general pattern of Hunter offering foreign access to Joe Biden, Hunter gets paid and then Joe gets a share of that. Is that basically what the general practice across many of these Shell companies work?
Speaker 10 (01:57:18): Congressman, as I outlined, the big guys, clearly Joe Biden, the details of some of those transactions I was not involved in, but that's clearly how they operated.
Speaker 12 (01:57:26): But that's the thought that we've seen over. And, Mr. Galanis, you said at the beginning that Hunter didn't really provide any sort of intellectual propriety asset value or anything of the sort that his entire value was the brand. Is that correct? How did you state that?
Speaker 13 (01:57:44): Yeah, we didn't rely on him for any work product other than delivering the Biden lift.
Speaker 12 (01:57:49): The Biden lift. And one more question for you, Mr. Galanis. Did you offer to provide information on Hunter Biden and Devin Archer back in 2016 to prosecutors and the SCC and what happened there?
Speaker 13 (01:58:03): Yes. Through counsel, I had offered to provide information on specifically on that to the SDNY, and I certainly also did the same thing to the Security and Exchange Commission, which was interested and suddenly was told to quash that interest. I understood that to be an order from the Southern District of New York to quash the SCC information.
Speaker 12 (01:58:26): Thank you. Chairman, I yield back.
Speaker 8 (01:58:29): Gentlemen time's expired. Chair now recognizes Mr. Goldman for five minutes.
Speaker 14 (01:58:37): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I only have five minutes, Mr. Bobulinski, so I'm going to try to move quickly and I'd appreciate if you just answer the questions. You testified that Joe Biden was involved in your business venture related to Oneida Holdings and Hunter Biden. So I want to drill down on the crux of what your testimony is. Oneida Holdings is the business venture that you are referring to, correct?
Speaker 10 (01:59:03): When I'm referring to what? Can you ask the question-
Speaker 14 (01:59:06): Any business you did with the Bidens?
Speaker 10 (01:59:09): My reference is the Sinohawk Holdings LLC and Oneida Holdings LLC own 50% of that.
Speaker 14 (01:59:15): Right. And Oneida Holdings was the 50% that was on the American side of that Sinohawk deal, right?
Speaker 10 (01:59:25): It was the 50% that was the Biden side of it. James Gilliar is not an American.
Speaker 14 (01:59:32): Sorry. Fair enough. And it was a joint partnership memorialized in an incorporating document, correct? And it had equal shares divided among five partners, is that right?
Speaker 10 (01:59:44): Are you asking me about what you're holding up? Because-
Speaker 14 (01:59:51): Were there equal 20% shares among five partners?
Speaker 10 (01:59:54): In what?
Speaker 14 (01:59:55): Oneida Holdings.
Speaker 10 (01:59:56): In the final signed documents?
Speaker 14 (01:59:57): Yes.
Speaker 10 (01:59:57): Is that what you're asking me?
Speaker 14 (01:59:59): Yes. It is not complicated.
Speaker 10 (02:00:01): Well, it is because there was-
Speaker 14 (02:00:03): You're just filibustering now. The answer is... You're filibustering. I get it. There were five partners, Hunter Biden, Jim Biden, Rob Walker, James Gilliar, and you. Each owned 20%.
Speaker 10 (02:00:17): Well, they didn't each own, their LLCs owned it, which is a material difference.
Speaker 14 (02:00:20): Do you see Joe Biden or an LLC related to Joe Biden on this?
Speaker 10 (02:00:24): I don't know if Joe Biden owned any of Jim Biden's LLC or Hunter Biden's LLC. I'll leave that up to the committee.
Speaker 14 (02:00:31): And do you know when this agreement was entered into?
Speaker 10 (02:00:35): The poster board that you're holding up or the actual legal document that was signed?
Speaker 14 (02:00:39): The agreement, sir.
Speaker 10 (02:00:43): The agreement.
Speaker 14 (02:00:44): The agreement was signed May 22nd 2017. Who was the vice president then?
Speaker 10 (02:00:52): May 22nd you said? I think it was Mike Pence.
Speaker 14 (02:00:55): And who was the president?
Speaker 10 (02:00:57): Donald Trump.
Speaker 14 (02:00:58): And when did you first meet Hunter Biden?
Speaker 10 (02:01:01): I first met Hunter Biden in early 2017.
Speaker 14 (02:01:06): When in 2017?
Speaker 10 (02:01:08): The day or the hour or a month.
Speaker 14 (02:01:09): The month is good.
Speaker 10 (02:01:11): I believe I briefly met him in New York. The first meeting, I had extensive time with him was in early May 2017.
Speaker 14 (02:01:19): And that was around the same time that you had those two meetings with Joe Biden, right?
Speaker 10 (02:01:22): It was. But prior to that I had numerous discussions with Hunter. I had lawyers working through the document that you asking.
Speaker 14 (02:01:29): Sir. Sir, can I please reclaim my time, sir? As I said, we have to move quickly here. Unfortunately, in your testimony earlier today, one of my colleagues asked you about that meeting at the bar 45 minutes to 60 minutes. And you were also asked about that in your transcribed interview. And in neither of your answers, did you mention any discussion that you had at that meeting with Joe Biden about the Chinese business venture. Yet in grandiose terms here today, you have declared that Joe Biden was involved and that you have mountains of irrefutable evidence to support it. So let's look at the mountains of irrefutable evidence. You provided the committee with a screenshot of a text message that is between James Gilliar and you dated May 11th, 2017. You see this? I don't know if you can see it. If you can't see, it's just you and James Gilliar though, right? You remember this text message, I'm sure.
Speaker 10 (02:02:25): Generally yes.
Speaker 14 (02:02:26): All right. And in it Gilliar writes, "Man, you are right. Let's get the company set up then tell H and family the high stakes and get Joe involved." And two days later, Mr. Gilliar sent an email to you CC'ing Rob Walker and Hunter Biden, in which he suggested a division of the company and included a proposal of "10% held by H for the big guy?" You remember that right?
Speaker 10 (02:02:52): The infamous email with the big guy? Yes, I do.
Speaker 14 (02:02:55): Did anyone ever respond to that email?
Speaker 10 (02:02:57): Yes, they did. Numerous times. Hunter Biden himself did.
Speaker 14 (02:03:00): Excuse me. You're right.
Speaker 10 (02:03:02): Well, I think that's important because Hunter Biden has claimed that he didn't and he responded to it.
Speaker 14 (02:03:07): You're just going to filibuster. I reclaim my time that's running out. But I will say no one responded to the big guy reference for 10.
Speaker 10 (02:03:15): Thank you for making my point. They didn't have to respond because they all knew the big guy was Joe Biden.
Speaker 14 (02:03:20): I reclaim my time, Mr. Chairman. Please control the witness. I would like to get a little extra time, Mr. Chairman, because I want to read what Mr. Gilliar said to the Wall Street Journal. "I would like to clear up any speculation that former vice president was involved with the 2017 discussions about our potential business structure. I am unaware of any involvement at any time of the former vice president. The activity in question never delivered and project revenue. Nine days later, the agreement without Joe Biden was signed." You and James Gilliar wanted Joe Biden involved, and that is why Hunter Biden dumped you and did the business on his own.
Speaker 10 (02:03:58): That's a blatant lie. Mr. Goldman, you know better.
Speaker 8 (02:04:00): Gentleman's time's expired. Chair now recognizes Mr. Higgins from Louisiana for five minutes.
Speaker 15 (02:04:06): Thank you, Mr. Chairman Mr. Bobulinski, thank you for being here today and we appreciate the candor of your responses, sir, which is reflective of the way you handled yourself and private testimony and deposition. So I thank you for communicating truthfully to the American people today. I'm going to ask you about the China Energy Fund Committee, the CEFC. You familiar with that, sir?
Speaker 10 (02:04:37): I am.
Speaker 15 (02:04:38): Is this a multibillion-dollar company, like a Fortune 500 company at one time?
Speaker 10 (02:04:43): It's even bigger than that. If you go back and look at its financials in 2016 and '17, it was probably one of the five largest private companies in China.
Speaker 15 (02:04:53): So exactly. So this was a major operation that had a lot of money. And apparently, because I'm going to hold up a memo here from. This is a chart from the second bank memo, and this shows disbursement of a total of almost $24 million for diamonds. So you have a major Chinese company spending a lot of money on diamonds, and apparently diamonds were used as a means of payment for the Biden family. We know that the bonds are testified that admitted to having two diamonds. We suspect that there are many, many more, $23 million worth of diamonds. Are you familiar with the exchange of valuable assets to pay the Bidens other than electronic transfers of monies? Are you aware of payments in diamonds, payment in cash, payment in board memberships, etc?
Speaker 10 (02:06:17): Am I generally aware of it oro was I involved.
Speaker 15 (02:06:20): Yes sir?
Speaker 10 (02:06:20): I read Jim Biden's and Hunter Biden's transcript multiple times. Jim Biden in that transcript references two diamonds that were given to Hunter Biden. One he implies was in 2015 by an individual who he couldn't recall his name, but the individual's name is Scott O, who is a surrogate for CEFC. And then apparently a second diamond was given at a meeting in Miami. And I really want to set the record clear. I was not at that physical meeting. I was in Miami, but I was not at that physical meeting. That's what I told the FBI in my transcript interview.
Speaker 15 (02:06:56): Are you aware, Mr. Bobulinski, of a pattern of bribery, of bribe payments coming from the China Energy Fund Committee?
Speaker 10 (02:07:07): I appreciate that question. I wish everyone on this committee would read the 1200 pages of testimony in an eight-day trial in the SDNY, where Mr. Goldman used to work while the actual trial was going on, that accused numerous executives, ultimately Patrick Ho of corruption, bribing, leaving shoeboxes of cash to a variety of political figures in Africa.
Speaker 15 (02:07:28): Exactly. So Mr. Bobulinski, from your perch within the Biden family operations and their interactions with major businesses in China, in the exchange of millions of dollars that are known, we track them through bank records, through suspicious activity reports, through emails, through communications that this committee has documented. There's no debate that millions and millions of dollars flowed into the Biden family's bank accounts. But the existence of other forms of payment is fascinating because diamonds are untraceable. We really don't know how many diamonds the Biden's received, do we?
Speaker 10 (02:08:15): We don't. And for somebody who's been to Mainland China, probably 10 plus times, Hong Kong, probably 15 plus times, hundreds of people... Congressman, I had hundreds of people working for me in Mainland China at one point. I never got a diamond from any businessman or woman.
Speaker 15 (02:08:32): I hear you. So Mr. Bobulinski, I'll shift quickly to a text message. Are you familiar with this? It is from a gentleman named James.
Speaker 10 (02:08:42): Generally, yes.
Speaker 15 (02:08:43): Yes. Says, "Don't mention Joe being involved. It's only when you're face-to-face. I know you know that. But they are paranoid." And there's a response saying, "Okay, they should be paranoid about things." And then there's a response saying, "For real." So what is meant by don't mention Joe being involved. It's only when you're face to face. I know you know that, but they are paranoid.
Speaker 10 (02:09:08): Well, I think it outlines how the Biden's operated, not specifically just with CEFC. You have Galanis here testifying and numerous other witnesses that have given you tremendous amount of evidence that outlined they work to obfuscate it, create layers of obstruction. That's the reason why Rob Walker was getting sent millions of dollars instead of Hunter Biden directly. That's the reason why Devon Archer was receiving millions of dollars instead of going to Hunter directly. You guys have a mountain of evidence that stacks high and answers that question on how they obfuscated. They lived in a world of plausible deniability.
Speaker 15 (02:09:41): Thank you, Mr. Bobulinski., Mr. Chairman, my time has expired. I yield.
Speaker 8 (02:09:45): Chair now recognize Ms. Norton from DC for five minutes.
Speaker 16 (02:09:49): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Galanis, thank you for appearing voluntarily for this hearing from Alabama. I understand you are currently serving a 189-month sentence in federal prison, almost 16 years after being convicted of not one, not two, but three different schemes. The victims of your schemes as the judge who presided over your criminal prosecution noted, included, and here I quote, " One of the poorest Native American tribes in the country, as well as pension funds held for the benefit of transit workers, longshoremen, housing authority workers and city employees, hard-working people every day, people among others." The court also noted that you personally benefited from these schemes. And again, I quote, "Using over $8 million, almost 9 million for lavish personal expenditures, including home expenses, automobiles, travel, clothing, jewelry expenses, and meanwhile, investors were left with nothing." But this is not your only encounter with prosecutors. (02:11:25) In another case, the Security and Exchange Commission charged you in 2005 with accounting fraud in connection with your involvement with Penthouse Magazine. And in 2010, you were convicted of attempted tax evasion and were sentenced to five years probation in order to pay nearly $2 million in restitution. In imposing your prison sentence, the judge noted that you are, and here I quote, "An extremely, extremely talented man, extremely gifted in his interpersonal skills, uncommonly so. He is very persuasive as an individual. And those were the tools in his tool bag of the fraud he committed and the people he ensnared, his intelligence, his interpersonal skills, his charm, if you will. And this is something that is not unseen in people who are commonly referred to as con artists." (02:12:40) Another judge who presided over your case, referred to you as, quote, "A skillful con artist." A skillful con artist. That is who my Republican colleagues are relying on to carry their water in this sham impeachment inquiry after their last star witness, the author of the infamous FBI Form 1023 was indicted for lying and outed as a likely Republican agent. It is time we put an end to this pathetic and desperate inquiry. I yield my remaining time to a Ranking Member Raskin.
Speaker 17 (02:13:27): Ms. Norton, thank you very much. So for more than a year now, we've heard innuendo, rumors, propaganda, big lies, but no facts, no evidence that could reasonably support the finding of impeachable high crimes and misdemeanors against President Biden. In our first real impeachment hearing, the majority invited several expert witnesses who came together and their witnesses agreed with that. That there was nothing that remotely approached the level of proof needed to support a finding of high crimes and misdemeanors that one would impeach a president for. And now we come back again today, and the majority has two witnesses. One, the designated con man as determined by two different federal courts, not without talent, but someone who deploys his talent towards the purposes of exploiting Native American Indian tribes, pensioners and other innocent investors. And then Mr. Bobulinski, who offers a lot of rhetoric and a lot of hot air, but absolutely no facts that could indict the President of the United States for high crimes and misdemeanors, impeachable offenses against the Republic. (02:14:39) The kinds of offenses which James Madison said are great attacks on the Republic itself. Great affronts to our Republican form of government. And nobody on their side can even tell us what is the impeachable high crime and misdemeanor, which suggests that they are moving in the direction of criminal referrals. And they should start by looking at their own witnesses. I yield back to you Mr. Chairman.
Speaker 8 (02:15:01): And I'd like to remind the Ranking Member and Ms. Norton, the witness, Mr. Galanis, was partners with Hunter Biden. That's why he's here. We have their partners. You could have invited partners, but you invited this guy.
Speaker 17 (02:15:17): Yeah, Donald Trump's partner, Mr. Parnas, who was working with Donald Trump and Rudy Giuliani.
Speaker 18 (02:15:20): Rudy Giuliani's partner.
Speaker 8 (02:15:22): Yeah. All right. Chair recognizes, Mr. Grothman.
Speaker 19 (02:15:26): Yeah, we got a variety of things I'd like to go through. But first, Mr. Lynch complained about Mr. Galanis testifying from prison. So I'd like to ask unanimous consent to enter into the record the Department of Justice's own press release announcing the sentencing of the Democrats witness Lev Parnas to 20 months in prison for, among other things, making false statements.
Speaker 8 (02:15:46): Without objection, on Donald Trump's partner.
Speaker 19 (02:15:49): Thank you. Now, Mr. Chairman, we had originally hoped that we'd see a few more witnesses here today. They're not here, but I would like to run
Mr. Grothman (02:16:00): A brief tape because I showed up today hoping I'd be asking these witnesses a little bit more about this tape. I know that there's some mystery or some people feel it's still ambiguous as to how this prosecutor was fired in Ukraine, and I wonder if this tape could do a little bit more to shed light on why that prosecutor was fired and why we want Hunter Biden and Mr. Archer here today.
Joe Biden (02:16:28): And so I got Ukraine and I remember going over convincing our team or others too convincing us that we should be providing for loan guarantees. And I went over, I guess the 12th, 13th time to Kiev, and I was supposed to announce that there was another billion-dollar loan guarantee, and I had gotten a commitment from Poroshenko and from Yatsenyuk that they would take action against the state prosecutor and they didn't. They were walking out the press conference, said no. I said, "We're not going to give you the billion dollars." They said, "You have no authority. You're not the president. The president said." I said, "Call him." I said, "I'm telling you, you're not getting the billion dollars." I said, "You're not getting the billion. I'm going to be leaving here." And I think it was, what, six hours? I looked, I said, "We're leaving in six hours. If the prosecutor's not fired, you're not getting the money." Well, son of a bitch got fired and they put in place someone who-
Mr. Grothman (02:17:31): I just wanted to put that up there because I do eventually want further efforts made to get Hunter Biden or Mr. Archer here because we have Joe Biden himself bragging that he got rid of a prosecutor who would've provided his son's business deals with a little bit more tough going or more observation, I'll put it that way. Now Mr. Bobulinski in previous interviews with this committee, you said that Joe Biden not only knew about the family's business dealings, but enabled them and participated in them. You went so far as to say, "It's clear to me that Joe Biden was the brand sold by the Biden family." Could you elaborate a little bit why it felt that way again?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:18:18): Correct. That's one of the challenging things I've had to deal with over the last four years with a focus of just simply telling the truth. The obfuscation around these facts are just beyond insane. So I'll use a meeting at the Four Seasons Hotel in Washington DC that I was not at, but apparently eight to 10 Chinese executives of CEFC were at with Chairman Yi and Director Zhang, Director Zhang, I interacted with extensively. And James Gilliar was in that room. Rob Walker, Hunter Biden was in that room. And my understanding based on Rob Walker's testimony is that Joe Biden walked into that room, sat down, shook hands with people, and spent five or 10 minutes talking about his family, I guess. I was not in the room. (02:19:05) People have tried to obfuscate that meeting like Joe Biden was walking in there to ask about the weather, and Rob Walker said that the Chinese didn't even know that Joe Biden was the former Vice President of the United States, which is beyond absurd. The power that those 10 Chinese individuals had to go back to mainland China and say that they were in a room with Joe Biden is the value of what they were giving.
Mr. Grothman (02:19:29): Okay. You stated that the Biden family concocted a scheme to give Joe plausible deniability. Could you elaborate on that a little bit?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:19:39): Well, I would just point to all the different text messages and communications. They call him the Big Guy. I wasn't involved with Mr. Galanis or Mr. Archer, but they're giving you numerous data points. There was obfuscation. They didn't use his name, they used the Big Guy. You weren't supposed to talk about it.
Mr. Grothman (02:20:00): And you personally met with the vice president?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:20:02): I did twice.
Mr. Grothman (02:20:03): Okay. And it was obvious. Did he say anything that indicates that you wanted him to help his son, that sort of thing?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:20:09): Well, he thanked me for helping his son and his brother and asked me to keep an eye on them as I walked him out to his car after he gave his speech on the second meeting of the Milken Conference.
Mr. Grothman (02:20:20): Okay. Just one other follow up, and this is kind of maybe a vague question, but I'd like to know it. One of the things that disturbs me about that is the interaction with the Chinese, or that's what we're dealing with today, but obviously other countries as well, that apparently in their own mind the way you deal with the United States is the way you deal with, say, a corrupt city council or something like that. In other words, you give them money and you get what you want. Do you want to comment on that or did you hear any stories about that or did you hear stories that they were surprised how easy it was to buy the US government?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:20:54): Well, I think-
Chairman (02:20:57): [inaudible 02:20:55] But answer the question, but please feel free to answer the question.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:20:58): Yeah, I think CEFC, and there's tremendous evidence, believed that they were bribing the Biden family and they were doing it via Hunter Biden.
Mr. Grothman (02:21:07): It's kind of shameful. Thank you.
Chairman (02:21:09): Very good. Chair now recognize Mr. Khanna for five minutes.
Mr. Khanna (02:21:14): Thank you. Mr. Chairman. Mr. Parnas, can you tell me about your meetings with Dmytry Firtash and why you believe the Trump campaign used his services?
Mr. Parnas (02:21:28): Yes, I was sent to meet with Dmytry Firtash because Dmytry Firtash had resources. He's an oligarch that was in Vienna waiting to be extradited to the United States, but he was very close with Vladimir Putin, Ukraine and lots of characters in that part of the world. And my objective at the time was to have him help us lean on Mikhail Zlachevsky and get dirt on the Bidens.
Mr. Khanna (02:21:58): And what type of dirt were you trying to get?
Mr. Parnas (02:22:02): We were searching for Hunter's hard drive that we were told was out there. We were searching for bank records to validate certain bank records that was given to me. Hunter's personal bank records that was given to me by John Solomon that he said he got from the FBI to certain payments that were going for car purchases. But the objective was to try to find a link from any of the payments that would go into Joe Biden's account.
Mr. Khanna (02:22:32): And who told you to get this dirt?
Mr. Parnas (02:22:35): Well, who told me? Rudy Giuliani.
Mr. Khanna (02:22:37): Anyone else that you remember?
Mr. Parnas (02:22:39): John Solomon. I mean, everybody that was part of the team, I mean.
Mr. Khanna (02:22:43): Did Bill Barr know that you were involved in getting this dirt?
Mr. Parnas (02:22:46): Absolutely. Bill Barr was notified of our investigation from the day he took office.
Mr. Khanna (02:22:51): Did you ever have a conversation with Bill Barr being lenient towards Dmytry in Bill Barr's role as Attorney General?
Mr. Parnas (02:23:00): I personally did not, but I was witness to Victoria Toensing and Joe diGenova having a conversation with Bill Barr about Dmytry Firtash.
Mr. Khanna (02:23:08): What did they say to Bill Barr?
Mr. Parnas (02:23:09): Basically they were telling him that the charges were false and that he needs to drop the charges and basically end the case.
Mr. Khanna (02:23:18): And why did they tell him to drop the charges on this Russian oligarch?
Mr. Parnas (02:23:22): Because Dmytry Firtash was going to help us getting dirt on the Bidens or whatever else the Trump campaign needed.
Mr. Khanna (02:23:28): So my understanding is you have the Trump campaign telling you to talk to a Russian oligarch to get dirt on the President of the United States for political reasons, and then someone from the Trump campaign is talking to the Attorney General to drop the charges because this foreign national is helping get dirt on a political candidate.
Mr. Parnas (02:23:44): Absolutely.
Mr. Khanna (02:23:45): Did Bill Barr indicate any willingness to drop the charges?
Mr. Parnas (02:23:49): After a meeting that Victoria Toensing and Joe diGenova had with DOJ, they came back and informed me that we're going to Vienna because to tell Dmytry Firtash everything's going to be okay.
Mr. Khanna (02:24:01): Do you know if Bill Barr in any way told you to say that?
Mr. Parnas (02:24:06): I was not privy in that meeting. No.
Mr. Khanna (02:24:08): Do you have any evidence that Bill Barr would have indicated to signal to Dmytry that the charges would be dropped?
Mr. Parnas (02:24:17): Only from conversations from Rudy Giuliani or Victoria Toensing.
Mr. Khanna (02:24:21): And what did they say about what Bill Barr said?
Mr. Parnas (02:24:23): They basically told me that this would be taken care of as long as Firtash played ball, and that's the message they relayed to me to tell Firtash.
Mr. Khanna (02:24:30): And they said that Bill Barr was conveying that to them directly?
Mr. Parnas (02:24:36): Yes. After meetings, there were several meetings. One, there was a private meeting where Rudy Giuliani went and bumped into actually Bill Barr at the Trump International Hotel, and he used that as a moment to take him aside, speak to him, and then there were certain official meetings through official channels where Victoria Toensing met with him. So yes.
Mr. Khanna (02:24:54): Do you know if anything was done with the charges?
Mr. Parnas (02:24:58): Until this day, Dmytry Firdish is not here.
Mr. Khanna (02:25:01): Do you believe that Bill Barr should be investigated for his conduct in potentially dropping these charges?
Mr. Parnas (02:25:08): I absolutely believe that, but not only that, I believe Bill Barr should be investigated into the coverup and trying to silence me to get the truth out of what really happened in Ukraine.
Mr. Khanna (02:25:16): And explain the coverup and what you believe he should be investigated with your last minute.
Mr. Parnas (02:25:21): My arrest was set up strictly to shut me up, to seal my documents, take away all my information, and turned me into a crazy man that had no way to prove what was going on. But the real story was Bill Barr was trying to save Donald Trump for an impeachment and use me as a scapegoat. What he didn't realize was Donald Trump was not going to stop and was continue doing what he wanted to do and that's why it blew up in Bill Barr's face. He also hired a special counsel at the time, Brady, to look into Ukraine. When we tried to reach out with my attorney too, Special Counsel Brady, he never returned our phone call. Nobody wanted to hear anything I had to say that had to do with Ukraine Donald Trump or Rudy Giuliani.
Mr. Khanna (02:25:59): Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Raskin (02:26:00): We're with the gentleman.
Mr. Khanna (02:26:00): Yes.
Mr. Raskin (02:26:01): Thank you. I just want to say you have stuck to the facts today. We don't hear bombast and rhetoric from you, but you're telling a true story and you've conducted yourself with great purpose and great dignity, and I know your son is here with you today, and I hope he and the rest of your family are proud of what you're doing for America. You're back.
Mr. Parnas (02:26:18): Thank you.
Chairman (02:26:19): Chair now recognizes Mr. Donalds from Florida for five minutes.
Mr. Donalds (02:26:22): Thank you, Chairman. It's been interesting hearing so far. Let's actually get to the actual paper trail of money flow from the CEFC into the bank account for President Joe Biden. And I want to start with a text message. July 31, WhatsApp text message between Hunter Biden and one Mr. Zhao. Real quick, Mr. Bobulinski, who is Mr. Zhao?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:26:48): Congressman Donalds, I'd just actually like to spend 20 seconds. If you noticed Congressman Khanna scurried out of here very quickly, and I'm actually disgusted as I sit here that he didn't address me based on the fact that I'm sitting here in front of the world trying to testify to the truth. In October, 2020, I have messages I'm willing to produce to both the Democrats and the Republicans that Ro Khanna sent to me saying, "You've always demonstrated to me that you're nothing but an honest with the highest integrity individual." And I was begging for him to go on CNN and tell the world in October, 2020. I have extensive emails with Congressman Ro Khanna in 2021 and 2022 where I begged him and his staff to sit down with me and look at my Blackberry phones that the Democrats are so focused on, to hire forensics experts and go through all of the factual information I had. So the fact that he did not even address me and then scurried out of here is disgusting to me.
Mr. Donalds (02:27:45): All right.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:27:46): Sorry. Mr. Donalds. I'll answer your question now.
Mr. Donalds (02:27:48): All right, so we're going to have to come off of that because now we're at three minutes 30 seconds. Mr. Chairman, for the record, I want to submit into the record two different WhatsApp text messages. One, July 31 between Hunter Biden and Mr. Zhao of CEFC, which stipulates that Hunter Biden wants to be able to move on and get the contract resolved, get the deal resolved, and that Mr. Zhao response and says, "Yes, the CEFC is willing to cooperate with the family." On August 31, there's another exchange this time... August 3rd, excuse me, August 3rd, 2017 between Hunter Biden and Mr. Gongwen Dong. And in this message they're talking about the stipulations of the arrangement between the Biden family and CEFC. I want to submit both WhatsApp text messages for the record, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman (02:28:38): Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Donalds (02:28:39): Okay, now to the money flow, because this is where the rubber meets the road. On August 3rd, they actually stipulate through WhatsApp text messages the exact stipulations of the deal. On August 4th, $100,000 is wired into Owasco P.C. from CEFC infrastructure. Mr. Chairman, I want to submit for the record a portion of the bank statement for the time period August 3rd, 2017 to August 31st, 2017 stipulating $100,000 going from CEFC into the bank account of Hunter Biden through Owasco P.C.
Chairman (02:29:14): Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Donalds (02:29:15): On August 8th, four days later, $5 million is then transferred from the Northern International Capital account of $5 million to Hudson West III. Hudson West III is a bank account controlled by Hunter Biden and Mr. Gong Wang, aka Kevin Dong, who is a CEFC associate. That money comes from a Northern International Capital bank account, a bank account that is tied to the CCP. Mr. Chairman, I want to submit for the record the bank statement demonstrating that transfer.
Chairman (02:29:49): Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Donalds (02:29:50): Okay, moving on. On August 8th, the same time period, there is a wire transfer of $400, 000 to Owasco P.C. from the Hudson West III bank account. That $400,000, Mr. Chairman, I have the transfer records in the bank accounts from the August time period. I want to submit that for the record.
Chairman (02:30:13): Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Donalds (02:30:15): Now here's where the fun stuff comes in everybody and I got a minute to do it, so we're going to get this done. On August 14, there is $150,000 that is transferred from Owasco P.C., which is controlled by Hunter Biden, to Lion Hall Group, which is controlled by James Biden. I have the records here, Mr. Chairman, of the $150,000 that has gone to Lion Hall Group from Owasco P.C. I want to submit that for the record.
Chairman (02:30:41): Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Donalds (02:30:42): On August 28th and I believe we have a screenshot for everybody in the room, on August 28th, Mr. Chairman, we have the withdrawal ticket from Lion Hall Group that is signed by Sara Biden, who is the wife of Jim Biden for $50,000 to withdraw from Lion Hall Group. I want to submit that withdrawal receipt for the record.
Chairman (02:31:01): Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Donalds (02:31:03): On September 3rd, on August 28th actually, Mr. Chairman, we have the deposit reference into Sara Jones Biden's account on the same day she withdrew it from Lion Hall. I want to submit that.
Chairman (02:31:14): Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Donalds (02:31:15): Last document. On September 3rd, 2007 from Sara Biden's own personal account, there is a check that is written to Joseph Robinette Biden Jr, the President of the United States today, for $40,000 signed loan repayment. A loan repayment by the way that Joe Biden's own personal accountant, Mr. Eric Schwerin, has no record for. I want to submit that for the record, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman (02:31:40): Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Donalds (02:31:41): To the members of the committee, it is clear to the source of this money came from CEFC and that CEFC is a company that is directly linked to the CCP and actually the chairman of the CCP, the chairman of the Chinese Communist Party, Chairman Xi Jinping. With that I yield
Chairman (02:31:58): Very good.
Mr. Raskin (02:31:59): Mr. Chairman, I've got a UC request if that's okay.
Chairman (02:32:01): Go ahead.
Mr. Raskin (02:32:02): First White House for sale, the staff report of the minority side, which details the CEFC's business interactions with Donald Trump. They own a $5.5 million unit in Trump World Tower and others. And then the Department of Justice press release announcing the sentencing of Jason Galanis in federal court to a term of 189 months in prison, ordering him to pay restitution of more than $80 million for three criminal fraud conspiracies against a Native American tribe, pension funds and other investors.
Chairman (02:32:36): Without objection, so ordered. Chair now recognizes Mr. Mfume for five minutes.
Mr. Mfume (02:32:43): Mr. Chairman, thank you. I'm sitting here and imagining what I would be thinking if I were not here, but rather somewhere around the country watching the Congress of the United States and in this case, this committee for 15 months hold these hearings on Hunter Biden and come up with not one impeachable offense in all that time. 15 months, over 10,000 documents and more as you can see today. As a result of that, this is a Do-Nothing Congress and we should be doing the jobs that we were sent here to do, which is not to have investigation hearing after investigation hearing over and over and over again, and then run to our favorite TV outlet to give interviews afterwards. We were sent here to get a job done. Taxpayers are looking at all of us. (02:33:37) Meanwhile, Americans, black, white, Asian, Latino, Native American and their families are wondering what the hell is going on. Is this another investigation hearing in this 15 months that has yielded nothing at all? It's the Do-Nothing Congress. You thought Harry Truman said it in 1948. Anybody can say it today. Look at what we've done in 15 months. Virtually nothing. Nothing at all. Senior citizens sit in their homes and watch C-SPAN or some other outlet carry this, some of them sitting in nursing homes, all of them worried about losing their social security. They're on fixed incomes and they expect the Congress to use its time and its energy to deal with things that affect them directly. (02:34:26) Students are defaulting on loans to colleges all over the country and no one wants to talk about that. Healthcare is inadequate in most places in this country, and diseases are ravaging our communities and people assume that at some point the Congress will deal with that. And so whether it's cancer, cardiovascular disease, kidney disease, diabetes, HIV, stroke, the disparities in the health system say, "Please, please give us a little bit of your time also when you're not dealing with Hunter Biden and when you can't prove that he's done anything wrong." (02:35:04) Crime is out of control, white collar as well as black collar, and assault weapons are still being used every day to shoot and kill innocent children and Americans. And we're sitting up here talking about something that we've talked about for 15 months with no substantial evidence. Can't get humanitarian aid to Palestine. Can't get military aid to the Ukraine. Children are looking and wondering what the hell is going on? "Is that what politics are about?" So we are doing a disservice. I know I'm supposed to be asking questions and Mr. Parnas I may have one or two for you, but I am so outraged at a Do-Nothing Congress just pointing the finger, pointing the finger over and over again and people are hurting, looking for real help. Can't deal with immigration because Donald Trump calls up and kills the immigration bill. And yet people say that's a major issue. Is it? I haven't seen the sort of attention that we thought we were putting to that or anything else. (02:36:09) And so this particular hearing will probably be followed by another hearing and another hearing and another hearing until this Congress expires in January of next year and we haven't done a damn thing to move the ball forward except make accusations. Life is too short. Now maybe some of you have a guarantee you're going to be around forever, but I don't. I came to this body first in 1987. I worked under Ronald Reagan and the first Bush and Bill Clinton and Donald Trump and now Joe Biden. This congress is not doing anything. It's not like the previous congresses. Trust me. That's why people have such a low esteem of those of us who say, "Well, I'm Congressman so-and-so." People on the street don't buy that. They don't see the action. So I'm done. I know I've exhausted my time. Mr. Parnas. A couple of quick questions and I'll let you go. Is it your understanding that Rudy Giuliani worked for an individual identified by the Trump administration as a Russian agent?
Mr. Parnas (02:37:17): Yes.
Mr. Mfume (02:37:18): Do you know what these Russian line actors were trying to do quickly?
Mr. Parnas (02:37:22): Push a conspiracy theory about the Bidens.
Mr. Mfume (02:37:24): Did you know that? Did you warn Rudy Giuliani?
Mr. Parnas (02:37:28): Yes, I did.
Mr. Mfume (02:37:29): And what was his response succinctly?
Mr. Parnas (02:37:33): He told me that, I mean, he agreed with me, but then proceeded to work with these people behind my back.
Mr. Mfume (02:37:38): And these people have been identified as Russian agents?
Mr. Parnas (02:37:41): Yes, sir.
Mr. Mfume (02:37:41): And we've got a meeting here of Mr. Giuliani with one of those. I'm disgusted as most people are about this process and the only way we get to a point where we get things done is that we learn to talk to one another across the aisle without having another conspiracy theory after another one, after another one. You don't buy trust that way. You buy contempt. I yield back.
Chairman (02:38:11): Chair recognizes Lisa McClain for five minutes.
Mrs. McClain (02:38:15): Thank you Mr. Chairman. I want to start off by saying I think most Americans are taught at a very young age that you are who you surround yourself with. I think, keep that in a premise, as I sat here and listened to everyone talk about how Hunter Biden is just this golden boy. I mean, are we really supposed to believe that Hunter Biden is the golden boy? His associates such as Jason Galanis and Devon Archer are felons convicted of fraud, yet he is the golden child. I want to talk about examples of Biden's influence peddling scheme. This time it was Romania. It follows the same general pattern as we have seen with other countries like China, Russia, Ukraine, and Kazakhstan. Here's the pattern. It's really simple. A corrupt foreign oligarch needs access to the US government. Hunter Biden sells influence to the US government. The oligarchs pay up. So let's just take a deeper dive into this Romanian scheme. Mr. Bobulinski, who is Gabriel Popoviciu?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:39:29): Gabriel Popoviciu is a businessman from Romania. Probably worth hundreds of millions of dollars I'd envision.
Mrs. McClain (02:39:35): Okay. Is it true that Gabriel Popoviciu faced corruption charges in Romania in 2015?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:39:42): It is.
Mrs. McClain (02:39:43): Thank you. And when you were in Europe with the Bidens to close on that CEFC deal with the Chinese, you separately negotiated with Popoviciu to get a 17th payment. Is that also correct?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:39:55): I did.
Mrs. McClain (02:39:56): Okay, but Popoviciu did not want to pay him, is that correct?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:40:02): Correct. You're talking about a 17th payment that would go to Rob Walker and then Rob Walker would distribute to Hunter Biden?
Mrs. McClain (02:40:09): That is correct. And is it because Hunter Biden had failed in the work? He was engaged by Popoviciu to do, which was to get the corruption charges dismissed by the Romanian authorities, isn't that correct?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:40:22): Well, it's two things that they had failed to do that but also that Joe Biden had left the White House at that point.
Mrs. McClain (02:40:29): Okay, so there's a dot. So I get 16 payments while Joe Biden's in the White House.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:40:38): Correct.
Mrs. McClain (02:40:39): But after Joe Biden leaves the White House, coincidentally the payments stop.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:40:46): Correct.
Mrs. McClain (02:40:46): Okay. Just want to make sure that we can connect the dots very simply,
Mr. Bobulinski (02:40:50): But obviously wasn't a coincidence.
Mrs. McClain (02:40:52): Right. I'm not much for coincidences, which neither other American people. But Mr. Bobulinski what do you think Popoviciu wanted Hunter Biden to do?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:41:04): I don't have to think because Gabriel told me personally he expected, and didn't want the details, he expected Hunter Biden, Rob Walker and James Gilliar to do whatever was necessary to impact his case in Romania.
Mrs. McClain (02:41:19): How do you know that?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:41:21): Because Gabriel Popoviciu told me that.
Mrs. McClain (02:41:24): From his mouth?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:41:25): Yes.
Mrs. McClain (02:41:26): Okay. So there's another dot that we can connect. Would that be a conspiracy theory?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:41:32): That's not a conspiracy theory.
Mrs. McClain (02:41:33): Okay, thank you.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:41:34): I would encourage you to interview Gabriel Popoviciu.
Mrs. McClain (02:41:37): Thank you. Lastly, after claiming he wanted a public hearing, Hunter Biden decided to skip today. Why do you think he skipped the hearing today?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:41:48): Is that a rhetorical or serious? Well, I don't think he wanted to sit next to me because obviously I've emphatically stated he perjured himself in his transcribed interview with the committee as did his Uncle Jim Biden. And for every fact he claims or wants to say I was high on drugs or obfuscate, I can show a document, a text message, a recording that his cross confirm that he's lying.
Mrs. McClain (02:42:14): Well, let's not let the facts get in the way of a good story, right? Here are the facts.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:42:18): Highly disappointing that he's not here though.
Mrs. McClain (02:42:21): I would agree. I would agree. Here are the facts. Hunter Biden was engaged by a foreign principal, Gabriel Popoviciu. It is well known that Hunter Biden met with the ambassador to Romania, Hans Klemm, in November of 2015. Hunter Biden was not registered under FARA. He stopped getting paid as soon as his father leaves office until you got Popoviciu to send Hunter Biden one more payment. Seriously, what services was Hunter Biden providing to the Romanian oligarchs for millions of dollars? We've yet to hear it. As far as the committee knows, Hunter Biden was never registered under the Foreign Agents Registration Act. If the Department of Justice applied the same standards it did in the Paul Manafort case, Hunter would be in more trouble than he is already in. Mr. Chairman, there are real FARA issues here that we need to continue to look at, and with that, I thank you for being here and I thank you Mr. Chairman.
Chairman (02:43:27): Absolutely. Thank you. Good job. Chair now recognizes Ms. Ocasio-Cortez from New York.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:43:32): Thank you Mr. Chair. Mr. Bobulinski, I heard your opening statement, it's submitted to the record part of our proceedings. I have a quick question. Simple. Is it your testimony today that you personally witnessed President Joe Biden commit a crime?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:43:59): I believe the fact that he was sitting with me while I was putting together a business deal.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:03): Did you witness the president commit a crime? Is it your testimony today?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:08): Yes.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:09): And what crime have you witnessed?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:12): How much time do I have to go through it?
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:14): It is simple. You name the crime. Did you watch him steal something?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:18): Corruption statutes, RICO and conspiracy, FARA.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:22): What is the crime, sir. Specifically?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:26): Wait, you asked me to answer the question. I answered the question. RICO, you're obviously not familiar with. Corruption statutes.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:34): Excuse me, sir. Excuse me, sir.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:36): FARA.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:37): Excuse me, sir. RICO is not a crime. It is a category. What is the crime?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:41): It's the category of crimes that you're then charged under.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:44): You have charges.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:45): A long hundred list of statutes.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:46): You have charges. Sir, please name.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:50): You want me to name the exact statute under RICO?
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:52): Yes.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:52): Well, it's funny, in this committee room, everyone's not here. There's over 18-
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:55): All right, sir. I reclaim my time.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:57): ... Lawyers that went to law school.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:44:57): I reclaim my time. I reclaim my time.
Mr. Bobulinski (02:44:57): I'll leave it up to you guys to define the statute under RICO.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:45:00): Thank you, sir. I reclaim my time. Clearly what we are seeing here today is a continuation of the 15-month saga of the Republican majority lost in the desert. Impeachment 101. The majority party, or whomever is raising impeachment must accuse the president of a specific high crime or misdemeanor. I would like to submit to the record H.Res.918, the house resolution to open this impeachment inquiry.
Chairman (02:45:36): Without objection, so ordered.
Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (02:45:37): This resolution does not outline a crime or misdemeanor. It's not here. Now, when we compare the chairman's opening from his previous opening, he's talking about Ukraine and Burisma and all of this. This entire inquiry is based on a blockbuster piece of information that was in a classified stiff room. And inside that room was a document alleging President Biden directly of a $10 million bribery scheme, a $10 million bribery scheme. Extremely serious. What happened? What happened a month ago, Mr. Chairman? That document, the FBI arrested the person who offered those allegations for falsifying his testimony to the FBI. This entire impeachment inquiry is based on an actual provable individual who has lied. Now responsible leadership would withdraw an inquiry based on that. Withdraw it. (02:46:48) Instead what we are seeing is that this committee was warned about the falsehoods of these allegations long before that. Warned by Trump's Secretary of State, Mike Pompeo, and yet they proceeded. Anyway, the chairman proceeded. Anyway, this committee was warned by Rudy Giuliani associate right here, Lev Parnas, after that document about the falsehoods of this then held hearings where your own expert witnesses said that there was no grounds for impeachment and you proceeded anyway. And finally, as if none of this was enough, the FBI arrested the individual who was the source of the entire to quote the chairman, "heart of the matter," to launch this impeachment inquiry and proceeded anyway. (02:47:36) At this point, the story is not the fact that the basis of this impeachment inquiry is wrong. The story is why it's proceeding anyway. Why is this committee proceeding based on false charges? And by the way, no charges I have yet to hear in the chairman's opening the allegation that they are specifically charging the President of the United States with. I'm hearing about Biden family. I'm hearing about this and that. I am not hearing the specific allegation by this committee. What is it? It's not here, and that is the problem. The story is when this committee knew that they were working with falsified evidence. That's the story. And with that, I yield back.
Chairman (02:48:34): Gentle lady yields back. Chair now recognizes Ms. Mace from South Carolina for five minutes.
Ms. Mace (02:48:39): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. On March 1st, 2024, Joe Biden stated he did not interact with Hunter or Jim Biden Business Associates, Mr. Chairman. I'd like to ask unanimous consent to enter into a record New York Post article. Biden insists he did not interact with his [inaudible 02:48:53].
Chairman (02:48:52): Without objection, so ordered.
Ms. Mace (02:48:54): We're going to go fast here. I have strictly yes or no questions. On that note, the New York Post article, Joe Biden also said, " Read the record of every single witness." So I did. I first read Devon Archer's deposition and he interacted with Joe Biden. Then I read the transcripts of Rob Walker, Eric Schwerin, George Bergès, Kevin Morris, Tony Boblinski, and Jason Galanis. And every single one of them interacted with Joe Biden and that's just the people we interviewed. Mr. Galanis, my first questions are for you. Did Hunter Biden call Joe Biden with Yelena Baturina on the line on May 4th, 2014? Yes or no?
Mr. Galanis (02:49:30): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:49:30): In that call, did Hunter Biden state on this call with Joe Biden that, "Everything is good and we are moving forward?"
Mr. Galanis (02:49:37): Yes, he did.
Ms. Mace (02:49:37): Okay. On the same call to Joe Biden in the call with saying, "Okay, then you be good to my boy."
Mr. Galanis (02:49:44): Yes, he said that as well.
Ms. Mace (02:49:45): Okay. Did Baturina agree to put $20 million into one of Hunter Biden's business projects days later after this phone call?
Mr. Galanis (02:49:53): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:49:54): Okay. Did Hunter Biden ever take a call from Joe Biden while at the Peninsula Bar in New York?
Mr. Galanis (00:00): I'm sorry, I didn't hear that.
Ms. Mace (02:50:01): Did Hunter Biden ever take a call from Joe Biden while at the Peninsula Bar in New York?
Mr. Galanis (02:50:06): Yes, he did.
Ms. Mace (02:50:07): During this call, did Hunter Biden update Joe Biden on progress in landing a business partnership with Harvest Fund Management?
Mr. Galanis (02:50:14): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:50:15): Okay. Was Harvest a $300 billion Chinese financial services company closely tied to the Chinese Communist Party?
Mr. Galanis (02:50:22): Yes, it was [inaudible 02:50:24].
Ms. Mace (02:50:23): Okay. Is Hunter Biden involved with Harvest
Mr. Galanis (02:50:25): Hunter Biden involved with Harvest in two ways through BHR, which is the fund that Harvest is the eighth-
Ms. Mace (02:50:25): Yes or no? Was Hunter Hunter Biden involved with Harvest, yes or no?
Mr. Galanis (02:50:34): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:50:37): Okay. As part of the deal-
Mr. Galanis (02:50:38): The extensive emails to that effect.
Ms. Mace (02:50:39): As part of the deal, did Hunter Biden want the company to reserve a board seat for Joe Biden?
Mr. Galanis (02:50:42): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:50:43): Okay. Did Henry Zou, Chinese businessmen, want assurances Joe Biden would join the board, yes or no?
Mr. Galanis (02:50:51): Yes he did.
Ms. Mace (02:50:52): Okay. Did Hunter Biden-
Mr. Galanis (02:50:52): He expressed that in emails as well.
Ms. Mace (02:50:54): Okay, thank you.
Mr. Galanis (02:50:55): And conversations.
Ms. Mace (02:50:56): Did Hunter Biden draft an email stating, "Please also remind Henry Zou of our conversation about a board seat for a certain relation of mine. Devon and I golfed with that relation earlier this week, and we discussed this very idea again, and as always, he remains very, very keen on the opportunity." Here is a photo of Joe Biden and Devon Archer and Hunter Biden golfing days before the alleged email draft. Do you believe " certain relation of mine" refers to Joe Biden?
Mr. Galanis (02:51:22): I don't think there's any question. It was based on firsthand conversations with Devon Archer who was in that picture and at that golf meeting, yes.
Ms. Mace (02:51:29): Did you ever meet with Devon Archer where Hunter took calls from his father?
Mr. Galanis (02:51:35): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:51:36): Okay. During one of these phone calls, did Hunter Biden tell Joe Biden that he and Henry Zou needed help, "getting across the finish line?"
Mr. Galanis (02:51:43): Yes, that's correct.
Ms. Mace (02:51:44): Okay. Mr. Bobulinski, do you recall receiving an email that floated the possibility of giving 10% ownership of Cino Hawk to Joe Biden through Hunter Biden?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:51:51): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:51:52): Okay. My last questions are for both of you very quickly, Mr. Bobulinski and Mr. Galanis, you both stated you were told not to use Joe Biden's name in communications, correct Mr. Bobulinski?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:52:01): Correct.
Ms. Mace (02:52:01): Mr. Galanis?
Mr. Galanis (02:52:03): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:52:04): Okay. Did Joe Biden participate in phone conversations and meetings with Hunter Biden, his business associates in foreign interest? Yes or no? Mr. Bobulinski?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:52:11): He clearly did. He met in place-
Ms. Mace (02:52:12): Okay. Mr. Galanis, yes or no?
Mr. Galanis (02:52:14): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:52:16): Okay. In Hunter Biden's deposition, he said he did not involve his father in his business. Did Hunter Biden lie under oath, yes or no? Mr. Bobulinski?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:52:23): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:52:24): Mr. Galanis?
Mr. Galanis (02:52:24): If that's what he said, yes, that would be [inaudible 02:52:25].
Ms. Mace (02:52:24): Okay. Is Joe Biden lying when he says he did not interact with Hunter Biden, Jim Biden, their business partners or foreign interests, yes or no?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:52:34): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:52:35): Mr. Galanis?
Mr. Galanis (02:52:36): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:52:37): All right. In a debate on October 22nd, 2020, Joe Biden denied Hunter Biden made money from China, that Hunter Biden and his business associates and foreign interest including money from Chinese businesses, business partners and or interest, yes or no? Mr. Bobulinski?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:52:51): I'm sorry. Did the Biden family make money?
Ms. Mace (02:52:54): Did Hunter Biden receive money from Chinese business interests?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:52:56): Correct. Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:52:57): Mr. Galanis? Did Hunter Biden receive money from Chinese business interests? Yes or no?
Mr. Galanis (02:53:02): Yes.
Ms. Mace (02:53:02): Okay. Thank you.
Mr. Galanis (02:53:02): He has had common interests and yes.
Ms. Mace (02:53:02): All right.
Mr. Galanis (02:53:08): Yes, [inaudible 02:53:09].
Ms. Mace (02:53:09): Joe Biden has repeatedly claimed that he was not involved in Hunter Biden, Jim Biden, or any other Biden family business deals. Today our witnesses have proved otherwise. Today we've established Joe Biden lied about interacting with Hunter Biden's business associates. It is my belief Joe Biden is the closer for Hunter Biden, Jim Biden and their business associates in foreign interests. Good luck to the left proving otherwise. Thank you and I yield back.
Mr. Comer (02:53:36): Gentlelady yields back. Chair now recognizes Ms. Porter from California.
Ms. Porter (02:53:41): The title of this hearing is Influence Pedaling: Examining Joe Biden's Abuse of Public Office. Look, the impeachment inquiry is dead. If it was on life support, my colleague Ocasio-Cortez just killed it. There is no allegation of a specific crime. President Biden didn't do anything wrong. There's zero evidence of that, and still both Democrats and Republicans and the media treat these hearings like the Super Bowl. But no one ever wins and Americans always lose. So, I've got a fresh direction for this hearing. All we have to do is cross off the part after the colon. There, just influence pedaling. (02:54:31) We should have a policy discussion about how to stop government officials from using their positions to get money or favors. Now that is a real hearing, one that nearly every American, regardless of party, wants us to hold. We could start by talking about how senior executive branch officials can leave public service, wait just one year, and then legally become lobbyists for big corporations scoring their new employers profitable government contracts and favorable regulations. They can even be paid by the big corporations during that short one year while they are waiting to become lobbyists as a down payment for their future ability to pedal influence. That's wrong. For the panel of witnesses, by show of hands, as Americans, would our witnesses support extending this one year waiting period to at least two years?
Mr. Bobulinski (02:55:33): I would.
Ms. Porter (02:55:35): Okay, so there we go. Republicans, Democrats, even convicted criminals, everybody supports that we should do more to stop influence pedaling. This is the kind of good government reform that Americans of all political stripes support. And I should know. In 2022, I passed that exact reform as an amendment to the National Defense Authorization Act with a bipartisan majority vote. What happened to that amendment? Why didn't it become law? The answer is simple. Nearly 500 former members of Congress work for lobbying firms and too many people around here want to follow in their footsteps and so don't want to make it harder for government officials to become lobbyists. (02:56:22) Ultimately democratic leadership under then speaker Nancy Pelosi let the amendment get stripped out of the final bill. When I offered up the amendment again during this Congress, Republican leadership under then speaker Kevin McCarthy never even put the amendment up for a vote. Both parties have let us down on fighting influence pedaling and tackling corruption. But I'm hopeful we can begin a new approach in this very committee. (02:56:54) American people, regardless of party, should know that an investigation was conducted into whether Joe Biden did anything wrong. We followed the evidence to where it led, a dead end. So, this impeachment inquiry should end today. And where should we go from here? We should stop partisan attacks on each other and address the real problem, that the American people believe that the rules that prevent corruption are way too weak to stop politicians on both sides of the aisle from influence pedaling. This committee should be working together in a bipartisan way to change the culture of Congress, to crack down on influence peddling and corruption, and just as importantly, to stop the perception of it. (02:57:37) Let me give you some facts. I don't even need a whiteboard for this one. 495 former members of Congress work for lobbying firms. 467 members of Congress take corporate PAC money. 78 members of Congress violated the Stock Act last Congress. Clearly we have our work cut out for us, so let's start the conversation today on what a bipartisan ethics reform package could look like. (02:58:09) Here are the organizations that could have come today as witnesses so we could have had a productive conversation. Oversight staff, do you have your notebooks ready? Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington, Common Cause, Project on Government Oversight, Public Citizen. With the right witnesses and the commitment to doing what the American people want, this committee can have a real conversation about the problem of influence pedaling, and we can pass legislation to create badly needed ethics guardrails. That would be real work, not a real circus. I yield back.
Mr. Comer (02:58:48): Before I recognize Mr. Timmons. Ms. Porter, I think you are sincere and I look forward working with you on that legislation.
Ms. Porter (02:58:58): Thank you very much.
Speaker 20 (02:58:59): Chairman, can we take a five minute break? I need to go to the bathroom.
Mr. Comer (02:59:03): Let us get one more and then we'll do that. Chair recognizes Mr. Timmons for five minutes. Then we'll take a break because we have votes coming up anyway.
Mr. Timmons (02:59:14): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. At our hearing last July, I laid out the scheme that the Biden's concocted to sell the Biden brand netting almost $30 million for various members of the Biden family. This scheme was repeated with various clients in Kazakhstan, China, Romania, Russia, and Ukraine. I'm going to spend my time on just one instance, Ukraine, specifically involving Burisma, which netted Hunter over $3 million during a three year period. (02:59:34) And to clarify the criminal offenses being alleged, for Hunter Biden, it is conspiracy to commit bribery 18 USC, section 201B2 A and C, and for Joe Biden's conspiracy to commit extortion under color of official right 18 USC section 1951B2. And if you want a refresher on those, just look up Senator Menendez and his wife's indictment. So, let's start with this. Foreign client has a problem. I've got an email here from Vadim Pazarsky, the Secretary of Burisma, and he is advocating that Hunter Biden intervene with high level US officials to facilitate meetings and communications expressing their positive opinion of Zlochevsky, the president of Burisma, to the Ukrainian president chief of Staff Prosecutor General with the ultimate purpose to close down any cases against Zlochevsky in Ukraine. (03:00:28) This is dated November 2nd, November 2nd. Now keep in mind, and again, foreign client has a problem. Zlochevsky is being investigated by Viktor Shokin, the Inspector General of Ukraine, and he needs help, the Biden brand. So, here we got bank records galore of Hunter Biden receiving, prior to this email, over $1 million dollars, after this email, $2 million. You'll find out in a second he really earned his fee. So again, client pays a Biden $3 million. Next. What happens? What happens? This is great. (03:01:02) 11 days later, 11 days later. We have the US Embassy in Ukraine announcing that Vice President Biden is traveling to Ukraine on December 7th. Oh, interesting. Vice President Biden travels to the country. Here we got a great photo of him touching down. They're very proud of themselves. So, Vice President Biden leverages US policy to achieve a favorable outcome for the client. We've all seen the video. He brags about leveraging US foreign loan guarantees to get the Ukrainian government to fire Viktor Shokin to end the investigation again. We've got the email from Podarksy saying that we need to leverage you who have not provided value yet for your million dollars in service, Hunter. He brings in the big guy. Biden leverages US influence, withholds a billion dollars in loan guarantee to fire Shokin. (03:01:56) So if that's not enough, we got the victory lap here. We got an email just a few months later saying, "Whoa, we won in less than a year. You brought us in, so take a victory lap." So, look, I mean this is straightforward. This is straightforward. Pay to play. It is bribery. Hunter Biden was paid $3 million at the lowest point in his life. He testified in the deposition that he was drug addicted, that he's never been to Ukraine, yet he's paid $3 million to get his father to go to solve his client's problem. That is the scheme. Mr. Bobulinski, does this sound like the scheme that you've seen the Biden family do?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:02:36): I wasn't involved in Ukraine, but the facts surrounding this are very similar to CFC and Romania.
Mr. Timmons (03:02:43): Thank you for that. So, this is the thing. If Hunter Biden were here, we would be able to ask him some questions, maybe clear this up. But he's not. He's not here. And what's interesting is that just yesterday, Peter Navarro reported to federal prison in Miami for four months for not showing up in front of the January 6th Committee. And I want to point out to everybody that the January 6th Committee was procedurally defective under house rules. It was procedurally defective because the minority leader did not get to appoint members to that committee. (03:03:16) The United States House of Representatives Oversight and Accountability Committee is a procedurally perfect committee, and we have authority to subpoena Hunter Biden, and he has to show up. He has to answer these questions and he has to tell the world that his father didn't leverage US foreign policy so he would get $3 million. This is no different than what Senator Menendez did. And look, the American people are not buying this nonsense y'all are selling. We have to restore. We must restore their faith in our institutions. And we have to stop this ridiculous two-tiered system of justice where the Department of Justice persecutes President Trump and hides Hunter Biden behind every corner. I mean, this is not the United States of America that the American people deserve, and we have to get our country back on track. With that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Speaker 21 (03:04:11): Mr. Chairman, pardon my inquiry. Did the committee subpoena Hunter Biden today?
Mr. Comer (03:04:16): The chair recognizes pursuant to the previous order and at the request of the minority witness, the chair declares the committee in recess for 10 minutes. Then we're going to come back in here and then we may have to recess again for votes.
Speaker 22 (03:04:28): Good job.
Mr. Timmons (03:04:28): We're all saying the same thing.
Mr. Comer (03:17:16): For five minutes.
Ms. Brown (03:17:21): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Today's hearing is another unfortunate attempt by my Republican colleagues to muddy the water in an election year with no proof, no evidence, no wrongdoing at all by President Biden. The American people are tired of this charade. As I said before, my Republican colleagues simply grasp at straws that do not exist. While House Democrats in the Biden Harris administration work to cut costs of prescription drugs, expand student loan forgiveness and mitigate the threat of gun violence, Republican members of Congress continue to chase after Russian disinformation, campaigns from the 2020 election, which have been thoroughly debunked again and again. (03:18:05) And as usual in this committee, we know who is in charge. It is the mindless broke bluffer, twice impeached, four times indicted, insurrection initiator, election denying, self-declared dictator on day one and puppet for Putin, the one who wants to terminate the Constitution and defund the FBI, the one who romanticized exchanging of love letters with North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un, the one who just last week embraced autocrat Orban of Hungary to discuss their diabolical plans to destroy our democracy, the one who proposed a policy to ban Muslims from this country, the one who just this week said, "Any Jewish person who votes for a Democrat hates their religion and Israel," the one who called neo-Nazis carrying tiki torches chanting, "Jews will not replace us good people," the one who referred to African nations, as I quote, "shithole countries." (03:19:08) The one who called NFL players, the majority whom are Black, sons of bitches for taking a knee in protest of the ever present racial inequality and police brutality that continues to pervade our justice system, the one who called Mexicans rapists and promised to build a wall and have them pay for it, and incased you missed it, it didn't happen, the one who told women of color, born in the United States, elected to Congress and serving on this very committee to go back to their own countries, the one who bragged about grabbing women by their private parts, the one who confused his rape victim, whom he claimed was not his type, for his very own ex-wife, the one who is an admitted and committed adulterer, who attempted to pay off a porn star for her silence, the one who has publicly mocked people with disabilities, the one who dodged the draft and referred to prisoners of war as losers, the very people who pay a high price, so we could enjoy the freedoms that far too many of us take for granted. (03:20:13) The one who boasted about being able to stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue to shoot someone and not lose votes, the one who promoted political and physical violence multiple times, including most recently at my rally in my home state of Ohio, where he declared there would be a bloodbath if he didn't win, the one who intentionally denied COVID was deadly and eventually suggested testing injecting bleach into our bodies to kill the respiratory virus that took the lives of one million people in the United States, the one who ordered his son-in-law get top secret security clearance overruling concerns flagged by intelligence officials, who according to this committee's chairman admitted the former president's son-in-law crossed the line of ethics by accepting a $2 billion investment into that very same son-in-law's fledgling firm only six months after leaving the White House. (03:21:13) If any of this sounds crazy, it's because it is. This might sound unbelievable, but it's all true. These are facts, indisputable facts, a thing that is known and proven to be true. This may be a foreign concept to some of my colleagues, but for those of us who still have a relationship with the truth, please know this is not an exhaustive list of inappropriate, unethical, and questionable behavior by the maniacal manipulator of Mar-a-Lago, because I could go on, but I only have five minutes. Yet here we are again trying to make sense out of nonsense. I would humbly, respectfully ask my Republican colleagues on this committee to stop falling over yourselves to win the approval of one, because millions of people are depending on you to defend our delicate democracy. And with that, I yield the remainder of my time to-
Mr. Raskin (03:22:10): Chair, now.
Ms. Brown (03:22:11): The ranking member.
Mr. Raskin (03:22:13): Oh, I don't know that there's much time left, but thank you for that eloquent and compressed recitation of some of what we've lived with over the last few years.
Mr. Comer (03:22:21): Chair recognizes Mr. Laturner from Kansas for five minutes.
Mr. Laturner (03:22:25): Mr. Bobulinski, I want to talk about May of 2017. To be clear, Hunter Biden was doing business with CEFC while his dad was VP. Are you aware of that now?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:22:34): Yes.
Mr. Laturner (03:22:35): Rob Walker told us that during his transcribed interview before the committee. But I want to talk to you about your meeting with Joe Biden, Hunter Biden and Jim Biden in May of 2017. Other members are going to bring up the meeting you had with Joe Biden at the Beverly Hilton the night before the Milken Conference, but I want to talk about the next day when you win as Joe Biden's guest to the Milken Conference. So, you watched Joe Biden deliver a speech that day. Then you had a follow-up conversation with Joe Biden, isn't that correct?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:23:01): Correct.
Mr. Laturner (03:23:02): What did Joe Biden tell you during that conversation?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:23:05): Well, as I've already publicly shared, I was brought back stage by his team because he had just given his keynote, and we just exchanged pleasantries. And then I walked him out to his car and he specifically thanked me for the work I was doing with his son and his brother and asked me to keep an eye on them.
Mr. Laturner (03:23:24): And my understanding is, Mr. Bobulinski, that after Joe Biden had left, you went across the street to the Peninsula Hotel and had a long conversation with his brother Jim Biden. Isn't that correct?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:23:32): I did.
Mr. Laturner (03:23:33): It's my understanding that you asked him how the Biden family does the business that they do while Joe Biden is such a prominent political figure. What was Jim Biden's response to you?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:23:42): Correct. I was actually concerned and asking from a position of concern. And Jim Biden's response to me was, "Plausible deniability."
Mr. Laturner (03:23:49): Plausible deniability. And by that you mean Joe Biden would be kept in the loop, but you weren't supposed to talk about it, especially in writing. Mr. Galanis, during your transcribed interview with
Mr. LaTurner (03:24:00): -- with the committees. You said a very interesting phrase. Say it, forget it, write it, regret it. Does this sound familiar? Is this consistent with your understanding of how the Bidens do business, Mr. Galanis?
Mr. Galanis (03:24:12): Yeah, very much so. That was an operating principle, yes.
Mr. LaTurner (03:24:17): But it looks like someone made a mistake. Mr. Bobulinski, you created two companies with the Bidens. I want to show you an infamous email discussing the ownership structure of one of those companies, CEFC. You can see on the screen, 20% for H, 20% for Rob Walker, 20% for James Gilliar, 20% for Tony Bobulinski, 10% for Jim Biden, and 10% held by H for the, 'big guy.' Mr. Bobulinski, who is the 'big guy'?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:24:47): The 'big guy' is 100% Joe Biden.
Mr. LaTurner (03:24:49): Mr. Bobulinski, Hunter Biden didn't respond saying, "Knock it off. We can't include Joe Biden," did he?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:24:55): No. And that's actually a critical point because remember --
Mr. LaTurner (03:24:58): Mr. Bobulinski, did you ever get a text message or a group text message or anything like that saying, "Guys, knock it off. Joe Biden isn't involved in this deal"?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:25:08): No, the whistleblowers actually have a text exchange where they're talking about everything else, but that, and the reason why they weren't talking about it is because everyone knew Joe Biden was the 'big guy.'
Mr. LaTurner (03:25:19): Hunter Biden begged for a public hearing, but it turns out he's too afraid of accountability to show up and tell the truth to the American people. But Americans don't need Hunter's testimony to know they're being gaslit by this president. It's blatantly obvious to anyone paying attention that Joe Biden is the 'big guy.' The CEFC deal broke the, say it, forget it, write it, regret it, rule of the Biden family businesses, and now they're trying to cover it up. Joe Biden said repeatedly that his family never made a dime from China. But Mr. Bobulinski just confirmed that Hunter, Jim and the 'big guy' himself all got a cut from the CEFC, China Energy deal. Let me be clear, the only service the Biden family ever provided was their ability to leverage the office of the Vice President of the United States to cash in overseas. My Democrat colleagues are going to try and tell you that Joe Biden wasn't on the final ownership structure agreement. But isn't it true if someone was holding Joe Biden's stake in the company, it wouldn't appear in the document? Isn't that the whole point of this email to hold Joe Biden's stake so his name wouldn't be in the document? Isn't this just plausible deniability in action, Mr. Bobulinski?
Mr. Bobulinski (03:26:37): It appears that way.
Mr. LaTurner (03:26:38): But plausible deniability only gets you so far. Now, I want to fast-forward from May to the end of July of 2017 when the Biden's cut you out of the deal. I want to show you a message that Hunter sent to his Chinese business partners. Please put it up on the screen. Hunter writes, "I am sitting here with my father and we would like to understand why the commitment made has not been fulfilled." So when Hunter Biden is desperate for money, Jim Biden's old trick of plausible deniability doesn't cut it. And when desperate times call for desperate measures, Hunter Biden let the cat out of the bag, said the quiet part out loud and gave the game away by calling on his father to help him shake down his Chinese business partners for the money. And it worked. Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Speaker 23 (03:27:30): Mr. Chairman, just point of inquiry, what was the last image we saw that you put up? Where did that come from? I just want to authenticate that.
Mr. LaTurner (03:27:41): This is the Ways and Means Committee Exhibit 300.
Mr. Chairman (03:27:46): Must be the IRS Whistleblower Note.
Speaker 23 (03:27:49): All right.
Mr. Chairman (03:27:50): Not an inquiry though. Anyway, Chair recognizes Ms. Stansbury for the last question.
Ms. Stansbury (03:27:56): All right. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman, and welcome to the GOP's day long campaign for Donald Trump. I want to start with Mr. Galanis to help connect some dots that have not yet been connected in this hearing. Mr. Galanis, you are serving just under 16 years for among other things, as was been said today, defrauding a tribal nation and specifically a tribal corporation held by the Oglala Sioux, which is why you are testifying from a prison today. But I'd like to ask you, Mr. Galanis, have you had an attorney representing you before this committee that you retained last December, and that attorney's name is Mr. Mark Paoletta, correct?
Mr. Galanis (03:28:40): That's correct.
Ms. Stansbury (03:28:41): And when you first testified before this committee in a taped interview, you were actually stopped by Mr. Paoletta from answering just a simple question about how you met him and who exactly was paying your legal fees. Now, I want to make sure that the American people understand exactly who Mr. Paoletta is because he is in fact a former lawyer to Donald Trump who served in the administration in the Office of Management and Budget, and was at the center of the Ukrainian pressure campaign for which Donald Trump was impeached. And in fact, Mr. Paoletta was Trump's chief OMB lawyer when he withheld aid to Ukraine to try to extort the Ukrainian government into investigating Joe Biden to support Donald Trump's campaign. And Mr. Paoletta literally wrote the memo to help withhold those funds. Now, I want to dig in a little bit on this pressure campaign, and Mr. Lev Parnas is here to discuss as an eyewitness who was there. (03:29:45) Mr. Parnas, we appreciate you being here and I want to move through this quickly. So just ask for simple yes and no answers. You've testified here today that Donald Trump repeatedly asked you and through Rudy Giuliani to put pressure on the Ukrainian government to dig up dirt on Joe Biden to support Trump's campaign, correct?
Mr. Parnas (03:30:06): 100%, yes.
Ms. Stansbury (03:30:08): And as we can see here in this picture, you were very much a business associate of Rudy Giuliani during this time. And as established in your testimony, you traveled to and met with Ukrainian officials and told them that the White House would withhold its support and aid to Ukraine if it did not cooperate with this bribery essentially?
Mr. Parnas (03:30:29): That's correct.
Ms. Stansbury (03:30:30): And as we all know, Donald Trump's administration and specifically the Office of Management and Budget did withhold that foreign aid in 2019. And here's the guy who did it, and he is representing the witness who's literally on Zoom with us for this committee today. And it's the reason why Donald Trump was impeached the first time. And the man at the center of that scheme is involved in the House GOP's inquiry. But I also want to point out that Mr. Paoletta is also involved in and very much in bed with the Thomas'. In fact, he represented Ms. Ginni Thomas, Clarence Thomas' wife in her involvement in the Stop The Steal before the January 6th Committee, and actually also goes on vacation with Mr. Harlan Crow and the Thomas's. So this man has quite an interesting roster and participation in this hearing. (03:31:31) But the bigger picture here is that Mr. Paoletta's presence is yet another indication of the way in which this hearing and this impeachment inquiry is part of Donald Trump's larger misinformation campaign just like it was in 2020. Where in addition to pressuring and withholding aid to Ukraine, Rudy Giuliani and the Trump Organization, as Mr. Parnas has established, planted the story in the media. And now here we are four years later as they've dredged it back up and are planting it back in the media using Congress, using this committee and using a baseless impeachment supported by Donald Trump's own allies on this committee to push that information out. (03:32:22) As members on this committee have trafficked in false evidence that was planted by a Russian operative to the FBI and is now in jail for that. All of this is in the service of propping up the criminal enterprise for which Donald Trump is at the top and has already been twice impeached. Rudy Giuliani and others have been exposed as they continue to traffic and Russian disinformation that not only props up Donald Trump, but it props up Vladimir Putin himself and his goals back in Russia and in Ukraine. So I just want to point out here that once again, as I said, when we had a false impeachment hearing a few months ago, that once again we see the --
Mr. Chairman (03:33:10): Times expired. Young lady, times expired.
Ms. Stansbury (03:33:10): [inaudible 03:33:11] of hands of Donald Trump all over this hearing.
Mr. Chairman (03:33:16): And just want to state, you made a mistake and said that Mr. Parnas was a Republican witness. He is very much your witness, not a Republican witness.
Mr. Parnas (03:33:26): But I was a Republican for Donald Trump.
Ms. Stansbury (03:33:28): Mr. Chairman, I do not believe I said that --
Mr. Chairman (03:33:28): Pursuant to --
Ms. Stansbury (03:33:29): -- so we can correct the record.
Mr. Chairman (03:33:29): Pursuant to the previous order, The Chair declares the committee in recess due to votes. Subject to the call of The Chair, we will reconvene 10 minutes after the three votes. All right.
Speaker 24 (03:33:42): Mr. Raskin's ready to go. [inaudible 04:22:37]
Mr. Perry (03:33:42): Scared him off.
Mr. Comer (04:22:56): All right. Committee will reconvene. Chair now recognize Mr. Perry from Pennsylvania for five minutes.
Mr. Perry (04:23:02): Well, thank you Mr. Chairman. Mr. Galanis, I'm going to turn my questions to you. I hope I can see you on the screen here shortly. Are you there, Mr. Galanis? There you are. Okay. If we can jump right into another Biden Chinese deal made while Joe Biden was in office. A deal I think you described in your interview as a quid pro quo where the Chinese sent millions in exchange for a post VP job for President Biden. Can you tell us what was Burnham?
Jason Galanis (04:23:35): Yeah. Burnham was an 85-year-old financial services company based in New York that owned an asset management firm and a securities dealer. But relative to the Chinese, it was an unimportant, small player. I'll give you scale, one and a half billion dollars versus $300 billion Chinese company.
Mr. Perry (04:23:58): What was Hunter Biden's interest in working with them, knowing that that was the situation?
Jason Galanis (04:24:06): I think Hunter Biden was already working with them through the fund that was created, the BHR Harvest, was the H. And is describing some of Hunter's emails that I have provided to the committee. He described the activity with BHR being the harvest activity as one of his only focuses. And his other focus would be the activity between Harvest directly and Burnham directly in a combination. His stated objective in his own words in writing was those were to be his only focus and his only priority of working with the Chinese on a go-forward basis.
Mr. Perry (04:24:45): Did you also say that he said the interest in working with Burnham was to make billions instead of millions? Is that right?
Jason Galanis (04:24:53): Yeah, I did say that. And that was on the basis of looking to become a much larger company where his equity interest would be worth a lot of money, billions, not millions.
Mr. Perry (04:25:05): And you said the Harvest Fund was a $300 billion Chinese financial services company. Was it likely connected or was it connected closely to the Chinese Communist Party and the Chinese government?
Jason Galanis (04:25:18): That's my understanding.
Mr. Perry (04:25:20): Okay. And who was Henry Zhao?
Jason Galanis (04:25:25): He's been described to me consistently by Devin and Hunter as the chairman, but he's ostensibly the head of Harvest. I think he's had a couple of different roles over the years, but he was always characterized as chairman and the decision maker for that entity.
Mr. Perry (04:25:44): Right. He's the chairman of the $300 billion Chinese entity connected to the Chinese government, the Chinese Communist Party. And he was based out of, where? Where was his base of operations?
Jason Galanis (04:25:56): In Beijing, China, PRC.
Mr. Perry (04:25:58): And like you said, you heard him referred to occasionally as Chairman Zhao. Right?
Jason Galanis (04:26:04): Most of the time it was Chairman Zhao out of a respect for the chairman. Yes.
Mr. Perry (04:26:09): Okay. Now there came to a point where Hunter wanted to bring Henry Zhao, the chairman of Harvest and their billions of dollars from China into business with Burnham. Is that right?
Jason Galanis (04:26:20): That's correct. That's correct, Congressman.
Mr. Perry (04:26:23): And why would he do that?
Jason Galanis (04:26:29): It was a financial decision. Chinese offered money and he offered political access. It was in exchange.
Mr. Perry (04:26:39): Fair enough. It is pretty obvious what Harvest brings, 300 billion. But why would Harvest be interested in Burnham versus other financial institutions? I'm sure there are other ones out there. And like you said, it was fairly small. Harvest is 300 billion. Why would they care about this small Burnham? What was the interest for them?
Jason Galanis (04:27:02): The self-evident answer is the political access. And then underscoring that is there are at least two emails produced that talk about exactly that, the influence of what Hunter had characterized as Henry Zhao's interest in the access vehicle. That was with explicit and in writing.
Mr. Perry (04:27:28): Okay. Joe Biden was going to sit on the board of a Chinese company connected to the highest levels of the Chinese government, the Chinese Communist Party. Stepping back, in your dealings with Hunter, what was the value that Hunter brought to the table?
Jason Galanis (04:27:44): It was the access to the inducement to induce companies like this Harvest Group to participate in Burnham. It was a, we'll call it relationship capital that he brought to the table. Not financial capital.
Mr. Perry (04:28:00): Relationship capital that-
Jason Galanis (04:28:01): And an economic value to the business.
Mr. Perry (04:28:03): Relationship capital that you described as the Biden lift. What was the Biden lift?
Jason Galanis (04:28:10): The Biden lift was simply Hunter's access to his father and his father's power and prestige in influencing the growth of a financial services business which is largely reliant on its reputation and ability to attract other clients.
Mr. Perry (04:28:26): I'm running out of time here, but it sounds like a quid pro quo to me, sir. And Harvest did in fact invest money in Burnham. You called it a material inducement. Can you explain what that means? And do you know how much the Chinese paid?
Jason Galanis (04:28:48): I was out of the picture toward the end of 2015. I believe that they ended up paying $4 million into Burnham. I believe though, as a result of the legal entanglements that I encountered, that the transactions didn't happen in the way people expected or that they had written about in terms of what the Chinese were expected to do.
Mr. Perry (04:29:09): All right. Mr. Galanis, I just want one last question. I'm going to show you a draft email that you provided to the committee. Mr. Chairman, I yield.
Mr. Comer (04:29:19): Objection on time. Good job. Chair now recognize Ms. Crockett for one minute... Or five minutes.
Ms. Crockett (04:29:26): One minute. All right. First of all, Mr. Bobulinski, do you know who Elections, LLC is?
Tony Bobulinski (04:29:35): [Inaudible 04:29:38].
Ms. Crockett (04:29:38): Yeah.
Tony Bobulinski (04:29:42): Well, it's not a who.
Ms. Crockett (04:29:44): Okay. Well, do you know what it is?
Tony Bobulinski (04:29:45): Yes, it's a LLC.
Ms. Crockett (04:29:47): Okay. And is it the LLC that your attorney works for?
Tony Bobulinski (04:29:51): I believe so, yes.
Ms. Crockett (04:29:52): You believe so? Okay. At this point in time, I'd ask unanimous consent to enter into the record a document indicating that the law firm representing Tony Bobulinski was paid $10,000 as recently as January of this year by the Save America PAC, which you may recognize as Donald Trump's PAC.
Mr. Comer (04:30:10): Without objection.
Ms. Crockett (04:30:11): Thank you. Now, so far in this hearing, it has felt like the worst episode of The Apprentice. I'm sure you're familiar with that show. It seems like my colleagues, and maybe you and some others are trying to become the next Vice President of the United States of America, you're auditioning or something like that. Because Mr. Bobulinski, I know that you take exception to the fact that your credibility has been called into question over and over. But when someone comes to testify under oath, whether it's before this committee behind closed doors or in person, then we have to evaluate someone's credibility. And sir, I definitely have always had issues with your credibility as I know that you are very well aware of. Let me remind you of what happened behind closed doors.
Tony Bobulinski (04:30:57): Well, you should ask Ro Khanna about my credibility.
Ms. Crockett (04:31:00): I haven't asked you a question. Okay.
Tony Bobulinski (04:31:02): You are?
Ms. Crockett (04:31:03): I haven't. When I ask you a question, that's when you answer. Otherwise, I'm talking.
Tony Bobulinski (04:31:08): Excuse me?
Ms. Crockett (04:31:09): With my time, because it's my time, I want to be clear that when we were behind closed doors, you called a number of people liars. You called the Wall Street Journal liars. You called Cassidy Hutchinson a liar.
Tony Bobulinski (04:31:22): She is.
Ms. Crockett (04:31:23): You called the FBI a liar. You called Rob Walker a liar. You called James Gilliar a liar. You called Hunter Biden a liar. You called Jim Biden a liar. And just today you added to your list. You called my colleague, Congressman Mr. Goldman, a liar as well. It seems like according to you, the only person that's telling the truth is you and everyone else is lying. But I want to move on to something else.
Tony Bobulinski (04:31:50): Is that a question or-
Ms. Crockett (04:31:51): It's not a question.
Tony Bobulinski (04:31:52): Okay.
Ms. Crockett (04:31:52): You'll know when I ask you a question, I promise.
Tony Bobulinski (04:31:55): Thank you.
Ms. Crockett (04:31:56): The other thing that I want to talk about is the fact that
Ms. Crockett (04:32:00): My colleague from the other side of the aisle talked about the company that we keep and she wanted to go through a list of people that she felt like we're a bad company because right now the majority has been relying upon the testimony of someone who's currently sitting in federal prison. And we know that your company is the company of somebody who's been found liable of fraud as well as defamation, as well as sexual assault, and for whatever reason can't pay his bills at this point in time. (04:32:38) But I'm going to ask Mr. Parnas, so this is a question to him, are you aware if Trump had any associates that have been found guilty of anything?
Mr. Parnas (04:32:51): Yes, lots of them.
Ms. Crockett (04:32:53): Lots of them.
Mr. Parnas (04:32:53): Me included.
Ms. Crockett (04:32:54): You included, okay. So when you were called here to testify, you weren't called here to testify for any other reason than to tell the truth; is that correct?
Mr. Parnas (04:33:05): Yes, Congresswoman.
Ms. Crockett (04:33:06): Now we started this whole sham off because of the 1023. And that was debunked by you; was it not?
Mr. Parnas (04:33:17): Yes, Congresswoman.
Ms. Crockett (04:33:17): Way before we started this impeachment inquiry, and you mentioned a number of times, this guy by the name of Rudy Giuliani.
Mr. Parnas (04:33:25): Yes.
Ms. Crockett (04:33:26): Now everybody is so stressed about the fact that Hunter ain't here today. But Hunter came and testified behind closed doors for over six hours. And every single one of them, they weren't limited to five minutes, they could ask whatever they wanted to. And there's a full transcript of his testimony. So I don't know what else they wanted to do besides the fact that they wanted to put on a show. (04:33:45) But let me tell you something. This whole thing is based upon something that Giuliani came up with.
Mr. Parnas (04:33:50): Yes.
Ms. Crockett (04:33:51): And we tried to subpoena him. That's what I remember, if anybody else remember... We asked. We said, "Hey, we should subpoena Giuliani." But kind of like when we were trying to get his cell phone, they shut it down. They don't want the facts. (04:34:06) But you would agree with me that considering the fact that you were working under Rudy Giuliani at the time that you went over to Ukraine, that he has maybe some valuable information that he could offer this committee as to whether or not there's anything that we should be investigating in the first place.
Mr. Parnas (04:34:24): Absolutely, Congresswoman. I wish that this committee would subpoena Rudy Giuliani, put him under oath alongside me to get to the bottom of the truth of what actually happened in Ukraine and to the manipulation that Trump and Giuliani and the team went to do.
Ms. Crockett (04:34:36): I agree with you. But somehow it doesn't look like we're going to get there. And I thank you for your time. With that, I yield.
Chair Comer (04:34:43): Time has expired. Chair now recognizes Mr. Biggs from Arizona.
Mr. Biggs (04:34:46): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. (04:34:47) Mr. Galanis, on May 9th, 2014, you received an email from Devin Archer confirming... Or you wrote an email, confirming that Ms. Baturina was investing with Burnham Investments 15 to $20 million. Is that true?
Mr. Galanis (04:35:05): Yes, Congressman.
Mr. Biggs (04:35:06): And let's talk about the predicate for that. Ms. Baturina is the richest woman in Russia and you knew her and were you invited to a party that she attended?
Mr. Galanis (04:35:22): Yes. In Brooklyn, yes.
Mr. Biggs (04:35:24): Let's have the invitation up please. And here's a copy of the invitation that you received; is that right?
Mr. Galanis (04:35:32): Don't yet see it, Congressman. I did receive an email invitation, so yes.
Mr. Biggs (04:35:38): Yeah, an email invitation. And did you go to that party?
Mr. Galanis (04:35:41): Yes. I did attend that party, yes.
Mr. Biggs (04:35:45): And was Hunter Biden at that party?
Mr. Galanis (04:35:47): Yes he was.
Mr. Biggs (04:35:49): And we know that he was because we have a confirmation of his calendar, which is the next exhibit. It was noted on there and he showed up there. And so all of that's true. It's all verified right there. And Yelena Baturina and her then husband, Yuri, they were at the party, right?
Mr. Galanis (04:36:12): Correct.
Mr. Biggs (04:36:13): With Devin Archer as well?
Mr. Galanis (04:36:16): That's correct.
Mr. Biggs (04:36:17): And during that party Hunter pulled you guys, the people we just named, pulled them away from where the party is and you go to a separate little area where it's quieter because there was over 100 people at that party. Is that true?
Mr. Galanis (04:36:31): That's true, yes.
Mr. Biggs (04:36:33): And all of a sudden Hunter says, "Okay, I'm going to make a phone call." He makes a phone call, does he not?
Mr. Galanis (04:36:39): He does.
Mr. Biggs (04:36:40): To whom?
Mr. Galanis (04:36:42): He called his father.
Mr. Biggs (04:36:44): Then Vice President Joe Biden, who was vice president at the time. What was said on the call, please? Wait a second before you tell us. The reason you know it is because he put it on speakerphone, right?
Mr. Galanis (04:36:57): He did after he said hello and then he put it on speakerphone. So I was first party to hearing it and initially-
Mr. Biggs (04:37:05): Please sum it up.
Mr. Galanis (04:37:08): I'm sorry, Congressman, I talked over you. The video conference, there's a delay.
Mr. Biggs (04:37:12): Please sum up that phone call for us, Mr. Galanis.
Mr. Galanis (04:37:14): Okay. It was a relatively short call, but he indicated that our friends had come in from out of town that then, the exchange, as I testified, was related to things were going to proceed. And the Vice President had said, "Look after my boy."
Mr. Biggs (04:37:42): And it was five days after that party that you received word from Devin that Ms. Baturina was in for 15 to $20 million with you guys, right?
Mr. Galanis (04:37:53): That's correct.
Mr. Biggs (04:37:55): Let's go to a different issue. Let's go to the Harvest issue. I'll just refresh everyone's recollection. When Devin Archer was there, because at that time he had to come in, he came on in and we had this great conversation with him. I said, "Hey, did Hunter ever indicate to you that the Chinese anticipated that after his father was out of office, he might join their company with one of their companies as a paid advisor?" Mr. Archer says, "Did he intimate that?" I said, "Did he indicate that to you?" Mr. Archer, "I don't recall, but potentially." And I said, "You don't recall, but it's not new to you? The concept is not new to you, is that what you're saying?" He said, "No, it's not new to me." (04:38:38) Why wasn't it new to him? Why wasn't it new to him? It wasn't new-
Mr. Galanis (04:38:43): It's because that was-
Mr. Biggs (04:38:44): Yeah, go ahead.
Mr. Galanis (04:38:46): It was an explicit discussion amongst amongst us that that was an inducement to the Chinese to invest in the Burnham business. That being the VP's position post, his official position.
Mr. Biggs (04:39:02): On a board of advisors, paid board of advisors?
Mr. Galanis (04:39:05): Of the Chinese company Harvest. Yes.
Mr. Biggs (04:39:09): And when you say us, who was the us that was discussing that?
Mr. Galanis (04:39:15): What I was referring to and just making that comment was Hunter, Devin and myself.
Mr. Biggs (04:39:19): Let's go to something else.
Mr. Galanis (04:39:21): There was a broader sort of circulation group about that, and that was reflected in an email from the staff member at Thornton Group who circulated the draft email that also reflected he had a similar conversation and drafted a letter based on that understanding.
Mr. Biggs (04:39:36): How long have you been incarcerated, Mr. Galanis?
Mr. Galanis (04:39:40): I've been incarcerated for eight years, Congressman.
Mr. Biggs (04:39:43): And you offered to tell the Southern District of New York and SEC about Hunter Biden's company, Rosemont Seneca Bohai and they rejected your offer, didn't they?
Mr. Galanis (04:39:57): On multiple occasions, that's correct.
Mr. Biggs (04:40:00): Why do you think they rejected that offer?
Speaker 25 (04:40:01): Chairman, I think he's over.
Chair Comer (04:40:04): Time is expired, but please answer that question. Answer the question Mr.Galanis.
Mr. Galanis (04:40:09): All I can tell you is what counsel said to me.
Mr. Biggs (04:40:12): Which was?
Mr. Galanis (04:40:14): Counsel had indicated to me that he had never seen a prosecution reject information, particularly paper-based information that could have corroborated my verbal statements.
Mr. Biggs (04:40:28): Thank you. My time has expired. Thank you.
Chair Comer (04:40:29): Very good. Chair recognized Ms. Bush for five minutes.
Ms. Bush (04:40:33): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. St. Louis and I are here today once again to focus on the real issues that affect our communities instead of this partisan circus. Let me start by saying that influence peddling is absolutely a very serious issue, full stop. (04:40:50) But we all know the truth. Donald Trump is the quintessential influence peddler in chief. Despite this for well over a year now, House Republicans have spent dozens of hours of precious committee time hearing testimony from nearly 20 witnesses on their baseless and increasingly embarrassing attempts to link President Biden to actions of his family members and implicate him by association. Even after all this time and effort, they haven't been able to muster up any credible links between the president and his son's business dealings. All they have proven is that they will do whatever it takes, including using their razor-thin majority and chairmanships to waste the people's time. (04:41:33) Let's let today's hearing be the final nail in the coffin of this sham impeachment investigation. I urge my Republican colleagues to admit that their quest to impeach the President has completely collapsed. They have fallen short and with each passing deal they are losing votes and credibility even within their own conference. It's time for them to move on. But that's not likely to happen because my Republican colleagues don't care about responsible governments or making people's lives better. They don't have an affirmative agenda. They would rather distract us all with these unfounded accusations against the President. (04:42:08) So it's no coincidence that under Republican leadership 2023 marked the most unproductive year in modern history for Congress. Aside from a failed impeachment investigation and unprecedented three week stint without a speaker and bringing our country to the brink of a catastrophic government shut down multiple times, Republicans have done absolutely nothing to demonstrate why they deserve to control any chamber of Congress, let alone the White House for which their cult leader, a twice impeached, four times indicted former president, is running to gain influence and control again. They're just grasping at straws and it'd be comical if it wasn't leading to real harm and real hurt in our communities. (04:42:55) The people of our country are the ones paying the price for their failure to actually govern. Instead of wasting all of our time, our hours and hours and hours going down fake rabbit holes and amplifying baseless conspiracies, we could focus on actual policy. We could focus on substance. We could focus on saving and improving the lives of our constituents, not misusing precious time and resources of this committee. What I'd rather focus on is the people who don't have the money and resources to buy influence. The millions of people in our districts who have been harmed by the ongoing refusal of the federal government to take full responsibility for the Manhattan Project waste and who are still getting sick from exposure to toxic radioactive waste, their own government created. It still lingers in communities all across the country like in St. Louis, Missouri, where proper cleanup still remains undone. (04:43:44) I am ranking member on the Subcommittee on Economic Growth, Energy Policy and Regulatory Affairs. I have repeatedly requested a hearing on Manhattan Project waste and its countless victims. I'm still waiting. We could focus on ending the crisis of gun violence in this country. Every day 327 people are shot in the United States. Every year 42,654 people die from gun violence. More children die from guns than anything else in this country. Why are we not acting to protect them? How are we not treating this like the public health emergency that it is? We could focus on improving the lives of incarcerated individuals and weaning ourselves off of the carceral state. A currently incarcerated individual is your star witness today, I applaud your inclusivity. And surely if folks convicted of crimes can testify before Congress, they should be allowed to vote. Why not enfranchise them? (04:44:39) What about reproductive rights and freedom? We have a public health crisis in this country where millions of people of reproductive age can't get the care that they need. People in St. Louis are being forced to give birth against their will. Republicans need and use abortion care just like the rest of us. Why not meaningfully address this issue? We need to focus on ending the atrocities in Gaza and Israel. Since January, malnutrition in children under five has nearly doubled. Global experts warn famine is imminent for 1.1 million people, half the population due to catastrophic food insecurity. Why are we not acting to reinstate UNRWA, prevent famine in the spread of disease and ending the continued slaughter of Palestinians? We do not have infinite time and resources. (04:45:20) I will stop there. Thank you. And I yield the balance of my time to Rep Goldman.
Rep Goldman (04:45:23): Thank you very much, Ms. Bush.
Chair Comer (04:45:24): 10 seconds.
Rep Goldman (04:45:25): I want to just point to a photo here. Mr. Bobulinski, you have testified that Cassidy Hutchinson's account that you met Mark Meadows then chief of staff for Donald Trump at a Trump rally in Georgia behind Secret Service cars. You were wearing-
Chair Comer (04:45:41): Time's expired.
Rep Goldman (04:45:42): Sir, you went over a minute late with Mr. Perry, we could have a little extra time. Trump rally that you said that she was-
Chair Comer (04:45:50): Time's expired. Chair Now recognizes Mr. Sessions for five minutes.
Mr. Raskin (04:45:54): Mr. Chairman, could we have some basic equity.
Chair Comer (04:45:56): If someone else wants to yield, she had eight seconds to yield him and he's got up here with a speech.
Rep Goldman (04:46:00): No, I have a simple question.
Chair Comer (04:46:01): He's already abused his privilege privileged by making a motion that wasn't even a motion-
Rep Goldman (04:46:05): I have a simple question.
Chair Comer (04:46:06): Chair has ruled. The Chair has ruled. The Chair has ruled.
Rep Goldman (04:46:09): What are you afraid of, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Comer (04:46:11): [inaudible 04:46:12] someone else to recognize your-
Rep Goldman (04:46:12): What are you afraid of? Why don't you let me ask the question?
Chair Comer (04:46:15): Chair recognizes the gentleman from... Oh, what purpose do you seek recognition, Mr. Biggs.
Mr. Biggs (04:46:21): Unanimous consent to introduce the documents into the record.
Chair Comer (04:46:25): Without objection, so ordered.
Mr. Biggs (04:46:28): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Here they are. One is the invitation that was mentioned. Another is Hunter Biden's calendar. Another is the email mentioned confirming that Yelena Baturina was going to invest 10 to $20 million with him. Another one is page 180 of the Galanis interview. Page 56 of the transcribed interview of Hunter Biden and also pages 41 and 42 of the Galanis interview.
Chair Comer (04:46:58): Without objection, so ordered into the record. Now Chair-
Rep Goldman (04:47:00): Mr. Chair I have a-
Chair Comer (04:47:01): What purpose do you seek recognition, Mr. Goldman?
Rep Goldman (04:47:03): I have a UC motion, Mr. Chairman.
Chair Comer (04:47:05): Proceed.
Rep Goldman (04:47:06): I would like to enter into the record the portion of the Devin Archer transcript where he says that Yelena Baturina never had any business dealings with Hunter Biden and that money went into their joint account was done by mistake.
Chair Comer (04:47:21): A mistake, okay, without objection, so ordered-
Mr. Raskin (04:47:22): And Mr. Chairman, I have one UC request as well.
Chair Comer (04:47:24): Proceed.
Mr. Raskin (04:47:25): This is from Salon Magazine. "It's embarrassing": Republicans worry they have "zero accomplishments" to run on in elections.
Chair Comer (04:47:30): Without objection, so order. Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Texas. Mr. Sessions for five minutes.
Mr. Sessions (04:47:37): Mr. Chairman, thank you very much. I'd first like to enter into the record 302s that were done with Mr. Bobulinski, what's known as Exhibit 400A.
Chair Comer (04:47:49): Without objection, so order.
Mr. Sessions (04:47:50): Thank you very much. Mr. Bobulinski, thank you for being here. Mr. Parnas, thank you for being here. And those of you who are appearing extraneously on our screen. (04:48:01) Mr. Bobulinski, tell me about very quickly about the professionalism of the organization that you work for in terms of paychecks, getting paychecks, providing the IRS with documentation of people who were paid out of the organization.
Mr. Bobulinski (04:48:20): I'm not sure I'm following your question.
Mr. Sessions (04:48:22): Were you ever paid?
Mr. Bobulinski (04:48:23): I was not.
Mr. Sessions (04:48:25): So you were never paid by this organization?
Mr. Bobulinski (04:48:28): I was not.
Mr. Sessions (04:48:29): Did you ever receive any enumeration?
Mr. Bobulinski (04:48:33): When we were in the process of trying to shut down SinoHawk Holdings LLC and Oneida Holdings LLC, I was compensated... It wasn't a compensation, it was a reimbursement of $50,000 of money I'd come out of pocket traveling around paying for hotels and stuff like that.
Mr. Sessions (04:48:52): In other words, people did not get paid or you didn't get paid that you were aware of. Were you aware that other people were being paid?
Mr. Bobulinski (04:49:02): The Biden family was paid. Hunter and Jim Biden were clearly paid millions of dollars.
Mr. Sessions (04:49:06): And how would you think that that information would be transmitted about them receiving that payment and going to the IRS?
Mr. Bobulinski (04:49:17): I'm not sure of those specifics. I'm just aware that they received those millions of dollars, obviously based on the brave testimony of Shapley and Ziegler that came public with a bunch of information. And then Senator Johnson and Senator Grassley's report I never saw. The only bank account I ever saw is the one I set up at JP Morgan for SinoHawk Holdings and Oneida Holdings LLC. JP Morgan was well aware that the Biden family were owners in that business. They authorized it, approved it and [inaudible 04:49:48] operating business-
Mr. Sessions (04:49:47): What social security number was utilized to set up that account?
Mr. Bobulinski (04:49:52): For SinoHawk and Oneida?
Mr. Sessions (04:49:55): Yes.
Mr. Bobulinski (04:49:57): We had to represent the owners of the underlying entity. So they were aware that Hudson West III owned 50% of SinoHawk holdings and they provided their information. On the Oneida side we represented that each of us owned 20% and I'd have to go back and look. I as the CEO probably provided my social security number. I'm not sure if we provided social security numbers for all five members.
Mr. Sessions (04:50:21): And yet, you-
Mr. Bobulinski (04:50:22): Or excuse me, tax IDs for their LLCs.
Mr. Sessions (04:50:24): Or tax IDs. And yet you never received money except reimbursement for out-of-pocket expenses that were related to the business?
Mr. Bobulinski (04:50:33): Correct. And imagine that $50,000 I was paid was actually from the legal side of SinoHawk Holdings and the Chinese, while the Bidens had defrauded me and were receiving millions of dollars into their own pockets.
Mr. Sessions (04:50:46): Were you aware that they were receiving millions of dollars at the time?
Mr. Bobulinski (04:50:50): I was not.
Mr. Sessions (04:50:52): Did you spend time with the Department of Justice on this matter?
Mr. Bobulinski (04:50:58): I did. I did. I had a voluntary interview with the FBI on October 23rd, I believe, 2020.
Mr. Sessions (04:51:06): They approached you or you approached them?
Mr.