TikTok creators join California Rep. Garcia to Oppose Ban

She's right there.

Okay, so you're going to introduce Sarah. Okay?

Okay.

Okay. Hey Sarah come on over here.

Hi.

Well, I want to thank all of you for joining us, but most importantly, I want to thank all of the TikTok creators and small business owners who are here that are fighting for their business, for their families, and for what they believe is their way to communicate to the public. So thank you all for being here. We wanted to make sure we gathered at a really important point where there might be, it's looking like a vote tomorrow morning on what could lead to a ban on TikTok. Now, we do know for certain that it is likely that if this legislation passes, there could certainly be a disruption of service to a platform that 170 million Americans use and that disruption could lead to a full ban. I want to introduce some folks. My name is Robert Garcia. I represent California. We're going to have four other members of Congress who are also going to speak and to TikTok creators as well. (01:16) We have Congressman Maxwell Frost, Congresswoman Sarah Jacobs, and Congresswoman Delia Ramirez. I want to thank them for being here. Now, I've been a fan of TikTok long before I came to Congress. It's a way to communicate. Also as an openly gay person it's a place where I get so much gay information where gay creators come to share news. And long before I got to Congress, I also used TikTok to gather what was going on around me, around the world, not just in politics, but also in entertainment and pop culture. We should also be honest with each other. TikTok is also fun. People use it and one in three Americans are on TikTok in some form of another. That's one in three US adults. We know that TikTok is also a space for representation and banning TikTok also means taking away a voice and a platform for communities of color and queer creators that have made TikTok their home. (02:15) What's really important for the public to know is any ban on TikTok is not just banning the freedom of expression. You are literally causing huge harm to our national economy. We have small business owners that are here and small business owners from across the country that use TikTok to move our economy forward. Some of these creators and these business owners solely depend on TikTok for their revenue and their job. And so to rush a process forward that could ban their form of work, particularly young people in this country, is misguided and it's rush. We also believe that singling out TikTok not fair. Now we all need to be honest about the dangers of social media and we understand those. Is there disinformation on TikTok? Absolutely. Is there also disinformation on Meta, on Instagram on X? Absolutely. All of our social media platforms need to be treated equally and need to be treated the same way, and to single out TikTok in this way, we believe is dangerous and certainly against freedom of expression. (03:28) We need to take a better approach to the social issues, and I personally believe that the movement to hopefully stop this bill and get more votes continues to grow. Before I turn this over to Congressman Frost, I want to say one last thing. A lot of us attended a classified briefing today on TikTok from a national security perspective. My opinion going into the briefing was to not support a ban, but I wanted to hear the information. My opinion leaving that briefing has not changed at all. There's nothing in that briefing that changed my mind that this is an immediate national security threat and that we're going to remove this platform for 170 million Americans. And so with that, I'm going to turn this over to Congressman Maxwell Frost.

Thank you, Robert. Hello everybody. I am here today to stand alongside of some of my colleagues and these creators to say, not only am I a no on tomorrow's TikTok ban bill, but I'm a hell no on tomorrow's TikTok ban bill. Look, we got to be clear. There's going to be an attempt to try to spin this to say, "It's not a ban, it's not a ban," but let's look at the facts. If you research and look into acquisitions of this size, putting a 180 day time period on it, five months especially, we're talking about a very large company. There's only a few players who can even afford to buy something like TikTok, which puts us into antitrust territory. There are automatic pauses that are put from a month to a year that can inhibit on this five month period that we put up. So essentially what this bill is doing is setting this whole sale up to fail. (05:11) And I truly believe that there's too much ambiguity here to mess with, especially when we're talking about an application that is a huge part of our lives and for small businesses and content creators here in the United States. That's reason number one. It's unreasonable to believe that in 180 days that a buyer will be found and that the deal can move forward, which would result in TikTok being banned, whether it's banned for a year or two years or six months, a ban is a ban. Number two, I believe that it is an infringement on our First Amendment rights and it violates the Constitution. You don't have to just ask me. The American Civil Liberties Union also agrees with us on this as well. And the way they put it I think is great. There's going to be a lot of folks who say, "Oh, well, because it's a for sale and they're not explicitly banning it, it's going to be fine in the courts." (06:01) A CLU calls that a fig leaf of an argument and I also agree. We're talking about a platform that allows people to put out information, news, whatever they want to put out that over 170 million Americans use, and I think that's important to keep in mind. The last thing I'll say that's top of mind for me is a lot of y'all know I'm from the state of Florida, the beautiful state of Florida and sometimes scary state of Florida. I live in a state where our governor, Ron DeSantis and his cronies and neofascist right wing is moving to change history in the state of Florida. Middle schoolers will read in their textbooks that Black people that were enslaved receive personal benefit from it. Don't Say Gay was passed to erase our communities from our campuses. They're passing legislation to try to shield what's going on with the climate crisis. (06:57) I hear from students all the time that get their information, the truth of what has happened in this country from content creators on TikTok and on different social media platforms. And to take that away, I'm just thinking specifically about my constituents right now, about people in the state of Florida, people in the state of Texas where we are in the front lines of these fascist attacks, it's platforms like this that can help combat some of that disinformation. (07:24) Now, I do have to say, am I concerned about American's data? Yes, I am. I highly concerned about our data being collective and being misused by both foreign adversaries and also domestic companies. But this bill does not fix that problem. Let's be honest here. This bill doesn't fix it. We could pass this. It could get signed tomorrow. I hope it doesn't. And in six months, in a year, we'll be back at the same conversation, possibly talking about some other social media platform that's misusing our data. So if Congress wants to be serious and craft legislation that'll protect all Americans from all bad actors, I'm in. But for this, count me out, 110%. And with that, I am going to introduce Sarah Jacobs.

Thank you. Well, hi everybody, and thank you so much to my colleagues for being here and for all of our amazing creators. Look, I sit on both the House Foreign Affairs and the House Armed Services Committees. So I assure you I fully understand the threats that are posed by the PRC. But the thing is, censoring and trampling on the civil liberties of 150 million Americans who use TikTok every day isn't the answer. Banning TikTok doesn't even mean we'll be protected from disinformation and misuse of our personal data, which American data brokers can still sell and do routinely and frequently, including to foreign counterparts. We need comprehensive data privacy legislation and thoughtful guardrails for social media platforms, not another Red Scare. Not a single thing that we heard in today's classified briefing was unique to TikTok. It was things that happen on every single social media platform, and frankly, the threats that they were talking to us about are things that will continue happening on every single social media platform, even if this legislation passes. (09:18) Here's the other thing. I spend a lot of time talking to other countries and thinking about America's role in the world, and we can't go around urging others to uphold democratic values when we're not prepared to do so ourselves. The United States has rightly criticized other countries for restricting speech, for banning specific social media websites, for making sure that only certain owners can own certain websites in certain countries. Doing so ourselves would tarnish our credibility when it matters the most. And ultimately, Americans, especially young Americans, we should all have the freedom to decide how and where we express ourselves and what kinds of information we want to consume. But taking away a place where millions of young people go to run their businesses, share their opinions, get their news and express themselves, that's not good policy. That is a blunt instrument to address a very real problem. Thank you so much. Now my colleague, Delia Ramirez.

Good afternoon everyone on this gorgeous sunny day, a perfect day to be standing here together. Like you heard, my name is Delia Ramirez and I get to represent the beautiful Illinois three that represents Chicago, one of the greatest cities in the world. I'm a bit biased maybe. Over the last few days, all of us have heard from constituents about what TikTok means and the great value it has to American people. In addition to joy, laughter, as you scroll up and down and realize three hours later you're still scrolling. TikTok has also been used as an opportunity to organize, for free speech demonstrations, for power building, especially for Black and brown communities. It is indisputable that TikTok and other popular social media platforms have an established place in our social, communal and political lives. And while there may be real data safeguard issues to address, which I agree with my colleagues here, it is clear that those potential data abuses are systemic. They require policy solutions that safeguard American's data and limit the data that social media companies can collect. (11:40) But I want to just reiterate what you heard from my colleagues. This bill is not going to do that. We are rushing into a vote without the necessary hearings necessary, without the community input. You're hearing people say that TikTok has changed their life. They have started their business. It has been an opportunity to communicate with the world, and we are so quick to rush to a vote not recognizing the full consequences this action could have on our communities and our small businesses. If we are really concerned about the security of American's information, we don't have to look much farther than our government's data collection. (12:21) We know that in recent discussion of Section 702 of FISA, it drew attention to the routinely abuse surveillance programs that broadly support the demand for privacy reforms. We have to significantly reduce surveillance overreach and safeguard American's civil liberties without compromising national security. And that work actually begins here at home. So instead of scapegoating and singling out a specific company, we have to get to work on truly protecting the American people. And I co-sign, I concur with my colleague here. I too will be a hell no when this vote comes up. To hear more about the impact that this vote can potentially have, I'd like to ask JT Laybourne, a creator in TikTok to share a few words. JT.

First I just want to say thank you to our Congress members for giving us the opportunity to be here. Like they said, my name is JT Laybourne. I'm from Farmington, Utah. I've been on this app since February of 2019, long before it was cool to be on TikTok. I joined with the intention of just trying to make people smile and leave this world a better place. From doing that, my wife and I were able to start a business, Just Think, and it was a movement. It was amazing. It's changed our lives. But I've watched this app do so much more than what is depicted elsewhere. I've seen this app raise over a million dollars for the American Heart Association after I went through open heart surgery in May of 2020 during the pandemic when my wife wasn't even allowed to be by my side. (14:05) This app showed up for her to support her when she couldn't be by my side. This app is so much more than just an app for "dumb" TikTok dances. So when I hear these elected officials literally mock and make fun of TikTok and its creators, I'm disgusted. This is a life-changing app. So many people, not only 5 million small businesses rely on it, but 170 million people rely on this app for more than just their livelihood. They rely on this app for their mental health. They've connected with people, they've made lifelong connections that wouldn't have been possible elsewhere because of TikTok, period. And so standing up here with all these amazing TikTokers behind me is a complete honor. And every single one of them would voice their opinion just like this. This is how we feel. This has to stop because it's not okay. My voice is on TikTok. My purpose is on TikTok. That's it. We can't let this happen. Period. Thank you. Turn it over to, sorry, Paul and Linda now.

Yep.

Hello everybody. My name is Paul, and this is my wife Linda. And we own a skincare brand called Love and Pebble. And to be honest, 90% of our sales are on TikTok, and it has totally changed our lives. So we're not just on TikTok. We thrive on TikTok, and we're one of the small businesses that do that. And because of TikTok, we've had so much success. We've been on Shark Tank, Today Show, everything is because of TikTok. (15:47) And I guess the message that I really want to get home to the American government and everybody that is trying to pass this bill is you will be destroying small businesses like us. This is our livelihood. We've created success, and it's so, so hard as a small business. It's so many ups and downs, but even in 2023, we almost shut our doors until TikTok shop came out and it totally exploded our business. So the one thing that I want to say is if you pass this bill, you will be destroying the American dream that we really believe in and that we love this country, as my parents, as immigrants that came over here and really believed in this country and built their lives from nothing to what they have now. That's what we're doing on this platform. So please do not pass this.

Thank you all. And one last point, and then if there's a couple of questions, we'll take those and then we're going to wrap up. Something that was said earlier, the countries that we criticize, countries like Russia, countries like Iran, they are known for silencing social media companies. They're known for silencing opposition or information they don't seem to agree with. The United States cannot be in the same category as these countries that we continuously, that we continuously go after on issues of free speech. Part of free speech is also hearing things you may disagree with. And so you have our support and just know that we're in a fight every single minute until this vote happens in a week are going to work to ensure that we stop this ban of TikTok. And with that, if there's a couple of questions from the press we'll go into, yes.

Hi, I'm Ashley Gold with Axios. You mentioned there was nothing in the classified briefing that made you feel like TikTok is an immediate threat or anything like that. What I hear from a lot of other lawmakers is, yes, it's true that TikTok has the same issues every other social media platform does, but there's a unique threat because ByteDance is a Chinese company and therefore were always have to listen to Beijing if they have a request. So what did they say during the intel briefing? Did they say anything specifically about that since that's unique to TikTok? And can you share anything else about that?

I'll say two things that you want to add. Number one, we do vast majority of our US trade with China. Trade. So if China wanted to disrupt us tomorrow, they have all the ability to do so. And so we're targeting one section of a relationship with China, which is a massive commerce relationship that we have. The second piece is we have yet to have any national security apparatus publicly produce any information that has shown that TikTok, the American company, that the affiliate is actually taking any data and sending it over to China to impact Americans. There's no evidence of that yet. And so we have not learned any new information and we certainly haven't heard evidence that that is actually happening. I don't know if anybody wants to add on that? Okay.

You've talked about the communal benefits of this platform, but why can't you create that same sense of community on another social media platform that doesn't have the same national security risks?

Do it then. Right? It's easier said than done. And look, this is to both questions really quick is it's not that briefing didn't put concern into us. This is something we're all concerned about. We're concerned about our data, but it's at that that briefing didn't change our opinion on this bill. Steamrolling this bill, this is the fastest I've seen a bill go through in my year and change in Congress. I'd like to see a bill that will maybe address gun violence go that fast, and we have 100 kids dying a day to have gone. I'd love to see a bill combating the climate crisis when we're literally in the middle of an existential crisis. So I want to be clear, I'm not up here saying, "We're not concerned." I would like to see ownership of TikTok change. Of course, this bill is not the way to achieve what we're looking to get because it will drastically interrupt American life for so many people, but also small businesses and content creators. (19:50) And again, we can find ourselves in the same situation in six months to a year talking about some other social media company. Let's talk about if you care about data privacy, whether it's a foreign actor or domestic, let's craft legislation on protecting American's data, period. If we do that, not only will we handle the concerns that we have with TikTok without interrupting all these small business owners and content creators, but we're also going to be able to handle the situation for the next thing and the next thing and the thing after that. So that's really what this is about. I'm not up here because I'm the Gen Z guy, first Gen Z, whatever. I'm up here because this is bad policy and we want to make sure that we get good policy and to handle this situation for us as we grow up and our kids and from here on out.

Great. Thank you.

Question. Donald Trump came out now against the band that he used to be for. Have you talked to any of your Republican colleagues? Do you have a sense that that is helping to weaken support among Republicans for passing this bill tomorrow? Does anyone have any sense of how that's playing with the house?

Yeah, I mean, I don't know what... Donald Trump's opinion changes often. So it's hard to know-

[inaudible 00:20:57] change tomorrow again.

It might change tomorrow again. What I do know is there is bipartisan opposition to this legislation. So you have Democrats and we're talking to more by the hour and certainly Republicans, many Republicans who I heard just speaking up in the last hour or two that have been surprises to me with that shared deep, deep concerns. But there is a full effort right now to try to slam this bill through as fast as possible. And I agree with Maxwell, why there isn't this urgency with so many other pressing issues is crazy. So I don't know if Del, do you want to add to that or anything?

No, I think you've said it. There's dangerous precedent. I serve as vice ranking member in Homeland Security. All of us have said there are major concerns right now around people's security, people's identity. We see that all the time. The issue here is that this bill is not going to address this. 180 days turnaround is not going to get us, first of all, TikTok to be interrupted. You're talking about people's livelihood in this moment and the fact that we have not heard from people, from community. We fast track through hearings. It's dangerous precedent that we just can't, can't allow to happen. And Congressman Garcia said it every day. As I talk to people from last week to today, people are like, "Well, I was leaning yes, but I think I'm leaning no." So I have to say that your calls, your stories, your personal experiences are being heard. And we want to make sure that it actually is in effect when we go and vote tomorrow.

And because people are actually taking the time to read the bill, when this first came out, it felt like it was steam roll. It's going to have 365 votes or however many members of Congress there are. As time goes by, people are reading the bill fielding objections from stakeholders in the community, learning about the fact that this isn't a good policy to adjust the problem, and they're coming from being a yes to a no. I'll tell you if this week vote was postponed until next week, we'd see even more people be in opposition to it.

And one more thing, this whole idea that some folks have been complaining that somehow TikTok and creators and users are organizing to call in offices is ridiculous. Thank you for calling offices. That is actually your right to be able to call offices and organize and people are upset because people are sharing their points of view is just wrong. We have time, maybe for one-

More point on this. My colleagues are upset about these calls from the offices. What about when billionaires put billions of dollars into super pacts to impact our elections? Right?

That's exactly right. That's exactly right. Yes. Last questions.

Two part question here. Number one, do you think the bill's going to pass the house tomorrow if you're hearing more opposition? And number two, if it does pass the house, who are you working with in the Senate right now to keep the bill from moving forward there?

So one, we obviously don't know what it's going to look like. I do know that I'm more... Look, I'm not overly optimistic in a situation where there is huge forces trying to slam this thing through. However, every hour there's more and more people that I'm hearing are going to vote no. So if we keep up the pressure and keep up the conversation, I think that's really, really important. The second thing is if this bill passes the house, I know the three of us and many others will do everything we can to talk to our senators and ensure the Senate does not rush on this and they do the right thing. So I'm more hopeful in the Senate doing the right thing right now than us in the house. And last question that we got to wrap up.

The TikTok CEO is reportedly in Washington right now and has plans to meet with some lawmakers, members of Congress. Have any of the lawmakers here been reached out to to meet with the TikTok, CEO?

I have not.

Yeah, I haven't met with him either.

Would you meet with him if he came?

Sure. I'd meet with anybody.

I don't need to meet with any... I mean I am going to vote no.

Yeah, I'm going to vote no too.

I heard from my constituents.

That's right.

That's good enough for me.

Thank you all very much. Appreciate you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you so-