Courtney Johnson

Courtney Johnson (00:00):

If you create content around what you're obsessed with your audience, the right audiences are naturally going to gravitate towards you. If a video performs bad, I'm like, okay, that's just a data point, it's all a data point. The fear of putting yourself out there can be very scary. Because of this feedback loop, in a year or two, you're living your dream. If every single person likes what you're putting out and you're trying to please everyone, it's not going to be any good.

Amanda Glaeser (00:27):

I'm Amanda Glaeser, and today I'm your host on The Rough Draft. In this episode, I talk with content creator and solopreneur, Courtney Johnson. Courtney has such a fascinating methodology on creative storytelling. Her delivery mechanism is primarily social media, but she uses many types of digital marketing to grow her personal brand as a mentor and consultant.

Amanda Glaeser (00:49):

We talk about how she focuses on creating a lot of content no matter how good or bad she thinks it is, and how this not only led to her overall success, but also generated nearly 8 million views on what she would say is objectively a bad piece of content. We get into her simple daily habits, different tools used in her workflow, and how a content creator should never leave anything in their drafts. All right, here's my conversation with Courtney Johnson.

Amanda Glaeser (01:26):

Okay, so Courtney, I had so many things I was excited to talk to you about, by way of storytelling and creativity and productivity, but I was watching, I went back and rewatched some of your TikToks last night, and your tram posts get so much traction. I want to hear about your tram and why you make that content.

Courtney Johnson (01:47):

So I have a crazy house. It's actually not that crazy, it's a normal house but it's on this cliff mountain, so it's only accessible by a tram. This is what it's like living in a house that's only accessible by tram. I'm finally answering all of y'all's tram questions. Courtney, why is there a tram at your house. Guys, I don't know. I didn't build the house. That's not a tram, that's a funicular. I know it's a funicular, but tram house just sounds cooler.

Courtney Johnson (02:09):

Next question, where do I get my deliveries? On all of the instruction stuff, I just tell people to put deliveries on the tram. Yes, a lot of people get confused. Lastly, is it only my tram or do I share it? The tram is only for my house, I am solely responsible for it. Yes, there is security and I can lock it, luckily.

Courtney Johnson (02:27):

I've been obsessed with this house since I was in high school. It was on my vision board.

Amanda Glaeser (02:30):

This exact house?

Courtney Johnson (02:32):

Yeah, when I was, yeah, because it was an Airbnb, when Airbnb launched in 2008. So I was a teenager.

Amanda Glaeser (02:39):

No way.

Courtney Johnson (02:39):

Being like, oh my gosh, I got to go here one day. Yeah, I bought the house crazy enough, but honestly, the house, I'm like, this is an investment because this is a content investment. I did know that buying that particular house over buying another house would be good for content and it did work.

Amanda Glaeser (02:58):

So tell me a little bit about what you do on the tram because I know it takes three minutes to get down, three minutes to get back up.

Courtney Johnson (03:05):

I actually habit stack a lot of things in my life, so I habit stack my meditation on the tram because I have to go up and down at least once a day, and so I know I'll at least have six minutes of meditation. That's the smallest amount, the least thing I can do, it's the same in the car. If I am driving, I'm going to listen to an audiobook at least one leg of the trip of wherever I'm going. So even that's just like coming home from the grocery store, that's at least 10 minutes that I'm reading. It's the habit stacking.

Amanda Glaeser (03:33):

Okay. So tell me about habit stacking and why that's important to your process. Why do you meditate for six minutes a day and read 10 minutes out of a book every day?

Courtney Johnson (03:42):

Yeah, I think when it comes to habits, a lot of people try to go overboard where let's say you want to start working out. You think you have to go to the gym for an hour every single day, you're never going to be successful doing that. Instead, what you can do is do a two-minute YouTube mini workout video in between a meeting. That is the thing that's actually accessible.

Courtney Johnson (04:04):

So with my daily habits, I have what's called a non-negotiable, so I have to do everything for at least 30 seconds, that way there is no way to fail. You can only succeed doing that, and of course you can build on that, but there's no zero days, no days where I don't accomplish those because the things are so easy and I haven't made it this overwhelming thing for myself.

Amanda Glaeser (04:25):

So what are some of those non-negotiables?

Courtney Johnson (04:28):

Meditation, going on a walk. I have a dog, so I literally have to go on a walk, she will go crazy if not. So that's again, forces me to do it. A mini workout, I'm talking two minutes, a mini stretch or yoga, again, two minutes, anything more is a plus. Journaling, writing.

Amanda Glaeser (04:47):

Okay, so it's a normal day. You've gotten all of your daily non-negotiables done. What does the rest of the day look like for you maybe on a normal work day?

Courtney Johnson (04:59):

Usually in the morning I create content. A lot of times my content ideas come when I'm journaling or free writing. So I get ready for the day, create content right after, and I try to batch as much as I can. So I have a rule that if I'm going to make one TikTok video, I might as well make two. Even if the second one is bad, I'm at least going to have that in my drafts. Again, going back to not setting these unrealistic expectations for myself, if I make one video I'm proud of, I post it. I do another bad video, instead of deleting it, I'm going to put it in my drafts. Two weeks in the future, maybe I'll look back at that and be like, hey, wait, this was actually good. Where my mind was at the time, I thought it was bad, but this is a unique idea. I can go with this. But I think so often we'll throw away those things without even considering that they may be good or somebody might find value in it.

Courtney Johnson (05:51):

Then after that, I go downtown to my co-working space, usually do some calls, work on some brand partnerships, work on my courses. Then I usually go to a yoga class or hang out with friends or something and go home. Yeah, that's my day.

Amanda Glaeser (06:08):

What I think is interesting about that is a lot of times as creators, sometimes we get so caught up in, I want it to be really good, I want it to be interesting, I want people to like it and engage with it. How do you get over that? How do you think through putting yourself out there, because you are really your brand, and so you are the face of all of your advice, all of your content. How do you think through that and get over that hump of, I don't want to put myself out there, it might be bad?

Courtney Johnson (06:38):

There's a lot. First, you just have to see all of your content as an experiment. Everything is a little science experiment, every piece of content you're putting out, and if you overthink it, a lot of times that limits the amount of volume you can put out. So you're not going to get good results because you're not seeing patterns. If you want to get good results in your content, you have to put out a large volume. Go back, look at what patterns you saw, whether that's your format, the topics, how you're presenting yourself, maybe even where you are, and then it becomes very easy to recreate and recreate.

Courtney Johnson (07:14):

But again, the fear of putting yourself out there can be very scary. I think a big part of that is because we have these expectations for ourselves or how we should show up. This fear around what other people will think of us, but it's important if you feel called to create content that it's to know that it's your responsibility. Not only is, yeah, this is this thing you want to do and it's important, but it is your responsibility because by putting out your art or making your music or publishing your book or whatever, it's not only sharing your information with the world, which is great, but also giving other people permission to do that as well. So the more we can all support each other in that and the more you can surround yourself with people that are creating content or art or whatever their medium might be, the easier it's going to be for you to do it too. That's normalized.

Amanda Glaeser (08:03):

Yeah, and I think the way that I've gotten over my own fear of posting anything is by seeing your content or somebody else's content, especially where they address that, where we just call it out. You call it the cringe mountain. Tell us about the cringe mountain, because it's one of my favorite things to think through when I'm creating my own content.

Courtney Johnson (08:23):

I love the concept of the cringe mountain. I have to say, I did not create this. A lot of people will tag me. I'm like, I didn't make this. I saw it on Twitter once and I cannot find the original creator. but you have a mountain with two valleys on either side. You have to climb and climb and climb up the mountain, but as you climb up, there's going to be people that are in the base of the mountain being like, where does she think she's going? What does he think he's doing? Who does she think she is? You're going to feel really uncomfortable because you're doing it in public. You're doing it to where everybody can see you, but once you get over the mountain, you're in the valley of where everyone else who has conquered the cringe mountain is.

Courtney Johnson (09:01):

The truth is, none of those people are going to discourage you. If you post your very first YouTube video, David Dobrik's not going to comment and be like, whoa, this sucks, man, your lighting is awful. No, if he saw your YouTube video, he'd be like, ah, keep going, that's how I started too, amazing. Or, if you start a new podcast and you mess up some stuff, Joe Rogan's not going to be like, that podcast sucks. He's going to be like, oh, keep going. I'm on my 5,000th podcast. So anyone in the land of cool who's got over it is not going to discourage you. It's only the people that are too afraid to even embark on the mountain.

Amanda Glaeser (09:39):

The people who have been just in my own journey that have been the most supportive have been the people, yeah, who've gotten over it and who have embraced that vulnerability of any type of self-expression is vulnerable because it's like, hey, this is who I am and I'm putting it out there. So especially when you're the face of your brand, it's just that much more vulnerable. It's like, this is me. One of the other things you talk about is your engagement with trolls. Tell me about that.

Courtney Johnson (10:10):

Trolls, trolls are tools, trolls are tools. You can leverage the trolls in your content. If you get people arguing in your comment section or if a lot of people disagree with what you're saying, your video is going to take off, your content's going to take off, If every single person likes what you're putting out and you're trying to please everyone, it's not going to be any good. Piece of art that has ever been created, it's had polarization. Polarization is the tension that makes something good. So yeah, you can use the trolls, don't be afraid of them, invite them in, if you want your video to perform well, there's going to be trolls. Trolls is a sign of like, oh yeah, I made it. That's a huge milestone. I got my first troll, yes, because nobody relevant lacks trolls. Every, again, person that's on the other side of the cringe mountain has a ton of trolls, and that's a badge of honor.

Amanda Glaeser (11:06):

Yeah, that's such a good way to think about it as a badge of honor and a tool to get the algorithm to notice you too. Oh, something's happening over here.

Courtney Johnson (11:15):

Exactly.

Amanda Glaeser (11:15):

So you have a ton of content on LinkedIn, on TikTok, Instagram. You have courses that you teach that show people how to be successful content creators. What's your favorite part of all of that? What's your favorite channel?

Courtney Johnson (11:33):

My favorite part is the writing, so LinkedIn tends to be my favorite channel. I'm a writer by trade, and the first place I'm going to go to put out an idea is writing, I'll write something in my notes app. It's fun to take that writing and turn that into a video or turn that into something else but the base, the core of it, the writing is my favorite part. I also really like LinkedIn because it is just the easiest place to grow. Everybody on LinkedIn is boring, so if you can have a single iota of personality, you're going to succeed on LinkedIn. Whatever your goal is, whether that's to get a new job or to get more clients or to sell your product or to educate somebody on some issue, LinkedIn is just the easiest place to do it. I like the other platforms too, but LinkedIn is easy and it's the shortest route to your goal.

Amanda Glaeser (12:23):

I think I've noticed that too, is there's just less people there, and so you can rise to the top. Especially if you're looking to monetize whatever it is you're doing, you want to get more clients, you want to sell something, you want to get a job, that's where those people are is on LinkedIn. That's usually why they're engaging with that channel versus in Instagram or TikTok where people are just looking to be entertained.

Courtney Johnson (12:49):

Exactly. There are more content consumers and content creators on LinkedIn, which is really rare. Then people are already going to LinkedIn for business decisions. I do a lot of social media and marketing consulting, and I've never got a client from TikTok or Instagram or anything, all from LinkedIn. So huge, huge opportunity. Even if you're not in a traditional business space, I still think you should be on LinkedIn.

Amanda Glaeser (13:15):

So you've gotten more business from LinkedIn, but you still create a lot of content on TikTok. What's the benefit to creating all of that TikTok content as well?

Courtney Johnson (13:25):

It reaches more people. I have a much bigger audience on TikTok, and I do really enjoy creating videos. It's a little bit of a different audience. It's more younger people that are looking to me for business advice, marketing advice. I really enjoy getting to influence peoples' decision making, because content is how we make decisions. If you're going to start a business, you're going to Google, how do I start a business? Read through some content, some blogs, watch some YouTube, and make your decisions this way. That is huge, the fact that we can impact other people's decisions, and that's just one example. Maybe the example is, what should I eat for dinner? Or maybe it's even something that's like, who should I vote for? Whatever. Whatever you care about, that is influenced by content, and TikTok is a huge place to have influence right now. The word influence and influencer is thrown around as silly. No, you are impacting other peoples' decision making. That is world-changing.

Amanda Glaeser (14:23):

That's how we met. How I found you was through TikTok and I came across your cheat codes. I love them and I think everybody should go and watch those videos.

Courtney Johnson (14:32):

So I have a series on TikTok called Problematic Career Cheat Codes, and I wanted to share the things that I felt were not talked about in normal career spaces. This is the advice that you're never going to read in a book or Google career tips and find it on the first page. These are things that you have to go through it to learn. They're also things that shocked me or surprised me. I'm like, why did I not know this? Why did I not learn this in college? So I wanted to share that with other people, so especially young people starting their career didn't have to go through the same mistakes or things that happen in order for me to figure out like, oh, aha, actually what they're telling you isn't always right. This is how you should act, this is how you should dress, this is how to lead people, this is how to make people like you in your office, all that stuff.

Amanda Glaeser (15:23):

It's interesting too, that you call them problematic cheat codes. I think there's something really smart there because you're putting this negative connotation on it, which is very hooky and gets people's attention. Is that intentional?

Courtney Johnson (15:35):

It is intentional. Some of them are a little bit problematic and some are things that I have not implemented myself, but I see other people do, and I see people have an advantage by doing them. So even if it's something that maybe I'm not going to implement myself, I still want to share that information because I want people to know that other people are doing this, people to decide for themselves whether they want to do that or not, but I want the information to be out there. So there is parts that are problematic. Majority of the tips are not problematic, it's baiting, the click bait, baiting the viewers.

Amanda Glaeser (16:11):

I think there's something, yeah, just in general, when we're consuming content, I want to consume something different. I don't want the same tip telling me the same thing over and over again. I don't want one more video telling me how to make a chicken [inaudible 00:16:26].

Amanda Glaeser (16:26):

So your personal brand revolves around educating other people. Would you say doing that through your content, through your videos or your writing, is that how you would describe what your insight is or what you bring to the table?

Courtney Johnson (16:42):

Yeah, I always look at it through the lens of creating value. How can I create value? You can do that in a few ways. You can educate, entertain, inform, all of that. I've chosen the educate route. A piece of content is not necessarily more or less valuable depending on what you choose, but it starts to become very apparent of, why am I watching this person? I'm inspired by them. Every time I see their videos, I'm inspired or I'm entertained, they're really funny, this is a great comedian, or, I'm informed. I feel very informed about what's going on in my industry or in the news or whatever. I want to be the educational route, but like we were talking about earlier, a lot of the education I put on is around the importance of personal brand, which is huge. Even through the career cheat codes, the biggest through line is just your personal brand is so important. It is the most important because your personal brand is almost like this insurance that you have. You get laid off, you lose a client, your business doesn't work out. If you have a strong personal brand and a strong network, you're always going to have another opportunity. You're never going to be left in the dust. You're always going to have something. It is the ultimate security and the biggest asset that you possess yourself.

Amanda Glaeser (17:54):

How do you find your personal brand? You've obviously done a lot of trial and error. How does one decide or lean into that niche or that personal brand?

Courtney Johnson (18:05):

So I actually don't believe in niches. I think the best thing to do is create content around what you're obsessed with, that's all. If you create content around what you're obsessed with, your audience, the right audiences are naturally going to gravitate towards you. So yes, there is some planning of, I want to talk about this, I have this goal, so I'm going to lean into this topic, but really if you're just talking about what you're obsessed with, you're going to have a successful personal brand.

Courtney Johnson (18:31):

It creates a feedback loop, so you're putting out all the things you're obsessed with. Maybe you're obsessed with running, graphic design, email marketing, Taylor Swift, and plants and gardening. Put out content around all of that. You're going to see very clear patterns in how your audience responds to that. Maybe your audience actually does not care about graphic design, but they really care about gardening, and that's something that's just a side hobby for you, you would've never thought that's how you provide value, but your audience wants more and more of it, so you're doing more and more of it. Then you're finding ways to monetize it, and because of this feedback loop, in a year or two, you're living your dream just by putting out the things that you're obsessed with and following the feedback loop of how you provide value, seeing what value your audience sees, making more of that, and it can bring you to your purpose.

Amanda Glaeser (19:23):

You do such a great job of leaning into what your things are, what people will respond to. You duplicate content across different channels and get the most out of an idea that works. How do you decide what content people like? What do you measure? How do you do that? What does that look like day to day?

Courtney Johnson (19:42):

A big indicator for me is questions. If somebody's asking questions, if somebody wants to go deeper, engagement views, all of that, yeah, it matters and you can see trends in that, but that's not necessarily what's going to, that's not the best indicator. A lot of times, views or likes is just a vanity metric, but a real metric is somebody texting you the next day and saying, hey, I saw your video about gardening. I really want to start a backyard garden. Do you have any tips? That was completely off the video, but that's somebody having questions. Or somebody in your video asking questions of, wow, can you go deeper into this, or, I actually don't know how to start my seeds, can you help me with that? That means people are starting to see you as an expert in your topic when they start asking specific questions to you and wanting to learn more. Again, this is from the education side of things. I don't think this is necessarily related to inspirational, entertaining types of content, but for educational content, you want to be seen as a thought leader and the more questions you get asked, that's immediate green flag for the content type.

Amanda Glaeser (20:48):

With that in mind, do you then create content where you're hoping? Do you shape your content in a way that you're looking for those questions or they just come up organically?

Courtney Johnson (20:59):

Yeah, I let them just come up organically because a lot of times we're not conscious to what's interesting about us and we're not conscious to how valuable our own knowledge is. We think everybody knows it, we're almost numb to our knowledge. So it's hard to position it, it's hard to tee up questions, it's hard to even have certain angles because we don't know. Again, the questions create another feedback loop because you're putting out content. People are asking questions that you would've never thought of. You would've never thought they're even relevant, that your audience would even care about that. That's what happened with my career cheat codes. I put out this random video. I would've never expected people to find value in my career tips because I'm like, oh, there's career tips everywhere. Why would they need mine?

Amanda Glaeser (21:45):

You and I have worked together doing some one-on-one training, teaching me how to use LinkedIn as a tool. Just like any other platform, it's its own beast. It's got an algorithm, it rewards you for certain things, it penalizes you for other things, and so it's important to know how to use it. So somehow we got on the topic of movies and I was talking about how much I love when movies use color as symbolism to display different things or emotions or times in people's life. I thought that was obvious that production companies were doing that, that directors were purposefully... In the movie Her, that's a really good example of one, and that everybody saw it, but they don't. I was totally blind to it. How do people find what that thing is that they're blind to? Because I would've never made that content if you hadn't pointed out that my eyes light up when I talk about film reviews. I just never would've even thought about it. How do you get to that place?

Courtney Johnson (22:43):

For me, it happened through volume. Just throwing out a million tests. Everything is an at-bat. So if even a tiny idea came up or I was doing something or thinking about something or reading something, and even if I'm like, this is so irrelevant, I'm like, I got to test it anyways. Testing tons of different types of content, the volume is so important.

Courtney Johnson (23:05):

The reason why I've blown up on TikTok so fast is because I had a library of 500 LinkedIn posts and I could go back and see all of those LinkedIn posts, which were the top performing, what were the most interesting, what were the best, and put that on TikTok. Now that I've been posting on TikTok for a while, I can see the data and see, all right, what's the most interesting? What questions am I getting? Again, it creates a feedback loop that informs, but it only starts with a ton of volume and a ton of tests.

Amanda Glaeser (23:34):

You got to get it over the cringe mountain to do it.

Courtney Johnson (23:34):

You got to get over the cringe mountain, yes.

Amanda Glaeser (23:37):

But you also have to create enough space in your day, enough time to create a lot of content, and it's not something, at least for me, I don't know, that is instant necessarily. Sometimes you can do a quick one and done, one take, but creating a lot of content takes a lot of time. How do you create all of your content? Because like you said, you have a lot.

Courtney Johnson (24:00):

Yeah, so I think a lot of people think that creating content takes a long time, but creating content that you think is good takes a long time. If I asked you to make a TikTok in 30 seconds, you could do it. You just would be like, this isn't any good. It might be good to somebody else, it might. Maybe the quick tip right off your head could be good. It's not necessarily in the time, it's the amount of time that we overthink and put into stuff.

Courtney Johnson (24:24):

Of course, you do need to create space so you're not always feeling pressure because we come up with the best ideas when we're relaxed. So repurposing content is huge. I repurpose all my content all the time. It's not about necessarily coming up with 100 things to stay unless you're in the testing zone, but figuring out how to say one thing 100 different ways and seeing what sticks. So I repurpose a ton of my content, whether that's literally just downloading the video and re-posting the exact same thing, or maybe taking a LinkedIn post and reading it as a script, or maybe taking a TikTok and just shortening it and re-posting that, but re-posting content is the best way to free up time and mental space and really get the longevity of it.

Amanda Glaeser (25:06):

What are some other tools that you use to get into that head space to one, have the courage to post a lot of content and whether or not you think it's good. Two, just the world is busy, there's a lot of distractions at any given time. To create the content, like you said, you have to come up with the idea, you have to take the time to do it, even if it's quick. How do you create that space in your day?

Courtney Johnson (25:28):

I highly recommend the book, The One Thing, it is fantastic. That was really my catalyst of starting to create that space. Literally overnight when I read it and the next day I was creating content and on this TikTok journey, which has been a huge part of my personal brand, so that's a great tool. Essentially, it's a book that centers around a question of, what is the one thing I basically have to do every day or need to focus on that will make everything else easier or unnecessary? So by nature of this question, you're making the rest of your day easier.

Courtney Johnson (26:04):

So when I came down to that question when I first did the book, it was post on LinkedIn. That was the thing that was going to make the rest of my day easier. Why? Because I didn't have to do outbound anymore. I knew if I posted on LinkedIn every day, I wouldn't have to go looking for clients, they would come to me. I knew that it wouldn't take as long to post on other platforms because I had this library of content. Similar to TikTok, I'm like, I'm going to get more students, I'm going to get more coaching clients from TikTok if I post every day. So again, whatever your creation, if you feel called to creation or drawn to storytelling in whatever way, I promise you prioritizing that is going to make other things in your life easier, but if you put those other things first, it's going to almost make all of this space go out. So yeah, I mean, it's just rearranging and prioritizing. Again, giving yourself permission to do it badly because you have 10 minutes in the day where you're walking in the hallway, you can do it. You're going to think it's bad, though. That's the hurdle, it's not the time.

Amanda Glaeser (27:05):

What's the worst video or the worst piece of content that you put out that was actually the most successful?

Courtney Johnson (27:11):

My highest viewed posts of all time. It's like 7 million views.

Amanda Glaeser (27:15):

Really?

Courtney Johnson (27:15):

Yeah.

Amanda Glaeser (27:16):

You thought it was terrible? You thought it was terrible [inaudible 00:27:18]?

Courtney Johnson (27:17):

I thought it was bad. It was a three or four second clip that I think I was just taking to send to a friend or something on the tram. I felt insecure because my hair wasn't done, I wasn't looking good, it was bad lighting. I put audio over it and it didn't work. So I just put a robot voice and said-

Recording (27:34):

POV, you randomly decided to buy a house that's only accessible by tram.

Courtney Johnson (27:44):

It's a bad angle, it's a bad piece of content, and it got 7 million views.

Amanda Glaeser (27:49):

Wow.

Courtney Johnson (27:50):

If I would've kept that in the drafts and it took three seconds to make, literally, three seconds, if I would've kept that in the drafts, I would've missed out on all of this growth. Again, it's the self-critical part of ourselves. We have to be like, all right, let me put it out. Maybe it's going to flop, maybe you're going to put out and it's going to flop. I've have plenty of flops, but if you find that one that hits, it's like rocket ship.

Amanda Glaeser (28:12):

So how do you look at the flops then? Do you look at those as failure, or how do you put those in line of all of the other content that you've done?

Courtney Johnson (28:21):

Well, I don't let myself look at any flop individually. If a video performs bad, I'm like, okay, that's just a data point. It's all a data point, and at the end of the month or at the end of 10 videos, then I can go back and see what the patterns are because it's going to become very clear. Oh, my message isn't bad. I'm not bad, I'm not dumb, whatever, but I noticed that in these three videos, I'm in my kitchen, and actually that's so weird, people I guess don't like the kitchen. It's really dark, maybe that's why. Maybe the lighting just makes it harder for people to see my face. Interesting, I'll think about that.

Courtney Johnson (28:52):

But I have a lot of clients come to me and they've only posted five posts ever, and they're like, oh, they did bad. I'm like, okay, well, you have to post 500 to really see if they did bad. If you think a piece of content did bad, measure it against the other low performing pieces of content and then you're going to see why, and it's never about you, it's never your idea, because you could post a video with an idea or a script that bombs and post another idea with the same video, same script, that does great. It could be something as simple as your audio is weird, or your hook wasn't very engaging to that specific audience, or maybe your hashtags didn't work.

Amanda Glaeser (29:33):

Yeah, or the time of day you posted.

Courtney Johnson (29:35):

Exactly, it's not about you.

Amanda Glaeser (29:36):

Yeah, there's so much we can't control when it comes to the content that we put out there that what eyes even get to see it, much less how they react to it.

Courtney Johnson (29:44):

That's why repurposing is so good too, because you can repurpose a bad piece of content and it could perform great. You could repurpose an amazing performing piece of content, it could bomb the second time. You really don't know, but it's again, a way to double, at least double your experiments and your at-bats by repurposing all of your content and people aren't going to remember it, they're not going to see it.

Amanda Glaeser (30:06):

Yeah, true. How many videos have I watched and I could not tell you that I've seen it. Yeah, and I'm not really an angry commenter either, so it's like there's not a lot of stuff I would take time to even think about enough to say anything, much less think anything negative about.

Courtney Johnson (30:26):

Yeah, but if it's a piece of content we found value from, we don't mind consuming it again. Like you, I'm sure you've seen the same films many times and you learn something new every time, or maybe-

Amanda Glaeser (30:36):

True.

Courtney Johnson (30:36):

... If you really like a YouTube video, you'll watch it again or listen to the same podcast twice because there's so much information you want to get it again. Behavior change requires repetition. Again, our content, the goal of content is to inspire behavior change in other people. So the more repetition we actually have on an idea, the more likely they're going to change that behavior. Whether it's, you should actually use this tool instead of that tool, or you should plant your seeds this way, or whatever it may be, repetition is an important part of that.

Amanda Glaeser (31:05):

What videos are in your drafts now that you haven't posted?

Courtney Johnson (31:10):

I have quite a few videos in my drafts. A lot of videos that are me responding to questions, like answering somebody's questions, and then they're in my draft because I'm like, this is a basic question, or is my answer inspiring enough or important enough? So yeah, mostly question reply videos.

Amanda Glaeser (31:27):

Okay, but even, I guess what I'm trying to get at is, even you who posts a ton of content, even you have videos in your drafts where you're like, maybe not.

Courtney Johnson (31:37):

Yes, exactly, but I try to force myself to post once a day, so I have to go back to those drafts or I have to repurpose. I make it a priority, but yeah, I feel cringe all the time. All the time. My cringe mountain right now is going live, so I've been challenging myself to go live more because I feel so cringe about it because I have to-

Amanda Glaeser (31:56):

Interesting.

Courtney Johnson (31:57):

... I have to talk for an hour.

Amanda Glaeser (31:58):

I was going to say, what feels cringe about live?

Courtney Johnson (32:00):

Because I'm talking to myself. Well, at first you go a whole five or 10 minutes where nobody is there, but you have to look like you're entertaining, so people join it. So I'm just talking to myself. Yeah, okay, hey. Usually I try to pick some topic, like 10 tips, and I'm saying these tips, but no one is on it. Then people get on it, and then you're answering their questions while you're talking, while you're looking at your notes, and it's just a lot at once. I start talking really fast and get nervous, so yeah.

Amanda Glaeser (32:27):

I've never thought about that before. Yeah, when you start a live, who's watching? Who's there?

Courtney Johnson (32:33):

No one, nobody, and they show a preview of your live so if you're just waiting, nobody's going to join it, so you have to be talking to yourself.

Amanda Glaeser (32:39):

That is wild.

Courtney Johnson (32:40):

It's uncomfy.

Amanda Glaeser (32:43):

So one of five people join, you're just like, oh thank goodness, and then the one person will leave. Then you're like, okay.

Courtney Johnson (32:50):

I guess I'll talk to myself again. It's so cringey, but I'm challenging myself to get over it.

Amanda Glaeser (32:54):

I don't watch a ton of lives, but the few that I have ventured into, anytime that I ask a question or leave a comment, I feel cringe. My cringe mountain, is even just leaving a comment or asking a question on a stranger's content to me just feels, I don't know, so, so weird.

Courtney Johnson (33:13):

Yeah, it is weird because, yeah, I feel weird doing that too because I feel like, oh, this is fan behavior where if somebody posts a video, I'm like, oh, I'm encouraging them and boosting up the post. I'm going to comment to boost this because I really like it, but I feel weird commenting on people's lives too.

Amanda Glaeser (33:28):

Yeah, but then when people comment on my post, I'm like, oh wow, I got a comment.

Courtney Johnson (33:34):

Me too. I'm like, please comment, please comment, ask me your questions, please. I need something to answer. I'm just staring standing here by myself doing nothing.

Amanda Glaeser (33:40):

Yeah, it's like when you're just out and about, maybe at Target or something, and you see somebody with a really cute outfit and really cute shoes and you want to tell them, but you're not quite brave enough because you'll feel like you look silly, but if somebody comes and tells you that you have cute boots on, you're like, oh my God, thank you so much, that made my whole day.

Courtney Johnson (33:55):

Exactly.

Amanda Glaeser (33:55):

It's so funny.

Courtney Johnson (33:56):

This is why I think a lot of salespeople are really good at content, at least in our B2B SaaS world. Salespeople are great at content because they have rejection all the time, they're always being rejected, it is normalized for them. Getting comfortable with rejection is really important, because you're going to be rejected. People aren't going to like it, people are going to, whatever. That's fine, it's almost like developing a muscle where you're like, oh, that's not about me. That's actually about you. It's fine, it's cool.

Amanda Glaeser (34:24):

Yeah, it's just a data point.

Courtney Johnson (34:26):

It's a data point.

Amanda Glaeser (34:26):

Yeah. I love that.

Courtney Johnson (34:27):

It's a data point, and it's their responsibility. It's their task on how it's their business, what they think about you, it's not your business. That's going on in their head, it's distance yourself from it.

Amanda Glaeser (34:38):

I feel like we could open a whole nother door to just talking about boundaries in general.

Courtney Johnson (34:41):

Boundaries, exactly, boundaries.

Amanda Glaeser (34:44):

So one of the things we haven't touched on yet is you do all of this yourself, essentially. You don't have a staff, you're a solopreneur, not an entrepreneur. What's a solopreneur?

Courtney Johnson (34:56):

I love the word solopreneur because it presents a different option from what we're used to. I think everyone thinks, all right, I either have to have a full-time job or be an entrepreneur and start a company and manage all these people and be responsible for all this stuff, and those are not the only two options. There are so many options and so many things in between. That's why I really like the word solopreneur, because it's essentially me creating my own income and my own life for me where I don't necessarily have to have a product or again, be responsible for people, because I don't really like managing people and I like flying solo. It eliminates a lot of problems.

Courtney Johnson (35:35):

Yes, there is a smaller, there's less potential. I think if you start a huge enterprise, there's more upper limits, but not even really. Maybe as a solopreneur you're never going to be a billionaire, but as somebody who maybe starts and exits a huge tech company, but okay, if that's the only upper limit, that's fine, but it's just an easier, simpler way to go about it that yeah, eliminates a lot of problems and also really puts everything on your personal brand, which is great. It's again, monetizing your personal brand.

Amanda Glaeser (36:10):

Yeah, so how do you stay motivated to do that? Because I think one of the things that is the hardest is maybe I have a bunch of great ideas, there's a lot of cool things I want to share, I'm not worried about cringe mountain, but just staying focused and motivated, that in and of itself can slow us down. How do you tackle that?

Courtney Johnson (36:32):

Yeah, that can be really hard. First, making content creation a non-negotiable. I have to post every day on something, even if it's bad. It is a non-negotiable. I will literally post an Instagram story saying, "I don't know what to post today," and boom, I did it. As a minimum viable product, the smallest, tiniest thing, have to do it every day. That's helpful because again, some days are going to show up, it's not going to be good, but at least you're creating that habit, and once that habit is in place, it's much harder to not do it than to do it. So that's been helpful.

Courtney Johnson (37:07):

I also have another tool, it's called Flown. I think it's flown.io, I'm not sure, but it's virtual co-working where you go to a Zoom call, you set an intention and you watch everybody else work as you work. It could be for anything, for on your computer, content creation, even some people go in, they're like, I'm going to do my dishes. Having other people around you that are working is really, really helpful. So that's another, I actually just started to implement it a few weeks ago, but that's another non-negotiable. I'm bringing in my day of, can I do at least one of those a day or maybe two of those a week or something? So it's been helpful.

Amanda Glaeser (37:41):

So it's just like an hour long, is your camera on?

Courtney Johnson (37:44):

Your camera has to be on camera.

Amanda Glaeser (37:45):

Okay, it has to be on.

Courtney Johnson (37:45):

It's required.

Amanda Glaeser (37:46):

Wow.

Courtney Johnson (37:46):

Yeah, there's a couple ones you could do 45 minute, an hour, two hours, four hours, and there's industry specific ones. So some are general, then some are only for people that are writing books. So you're writing your book as you're around 10 people on the Zoom call that are also writing your book, and it just switches your brain into this go mode. It also really teaches you the value of an hour. You're like, wow, I got so much done in this time. I also think too, if I'm going to take on a new project, do I want to commit a whole Flown a week to that project? That's helpful to contextualize it because a lot of times saying an hour or two hours, it's going to take this or that to do it is not real, it's not tangible.

Amanda Glaeser (38:26):

So along with Flown, this tool that you use, how is it just you? Do you have other people that you employ that you bring on from time to time to help you create all of this content? How do you, just the sheer volume of all of the content that you put out that represents your brand is, it's large.

Courtney Johnson (38:45):

The volume is really not that big. It's all repurposed. The volume that you see, it looks like, wow, Courtney's creating five Instagram posts a day and all these TikToks and all these stories. How does she do it? I really just make one a day, most of it's repurposed. I hire people from time to time. I hope I never have to hire a full-time person, but I have some contractors and some tools that just help me repurpose across different platforms. So I really don't touch YouTube, I have somebody that just repurposes my content to YouTube. I really don't touch Instagram Reels, I have somebody that repurposes that for me. Then there's again, some tools too, where I can schedule that make it a lot easier.

Amanda Glaeser (39:28):

Where do you find people who can schedule things for you in Instagram or yeah, just take care of some of those little tasks for you?

Courtney Johnson (39:38):

Yeah, Upwork is great for that, fantastic tool. LinkedIn is really good as well.

Amanda Glaeser (39:44):

Interesting.

Courtney Johnson (39:45):

Then I've had people just cold outreach me that I've worked with a few times saying, I really like your content, I want to learn a little bit more about what you're doing. You can hire me to do this. And I'm like, okay. Yeah, but Upwork is probably the go-to.

Amanda Glaeser (39:59):

But there's also another, I guess, good reason to actually read all of your messages too, that you get on LinkedIn, because I'm sure I get quite a few and I don't have the same following, but yeah. Do you read all of your messages and all of your comments that you get?

Courtney Johnson (40:13):

I do, but I'm starting to become a little too much because I find myself doing that as almost a thing where I'm trying to be productive, but I'm not really. It's not productive to go in and read every comment, and it's not productive to go through my spam Instagram message folder. But yeah, it's something that I, it's not a productive task, but I feel like it is in the moment, even though I know it's not. So it's something I'm trying to get over and work to not do.

Courtney Johnson (40:41):

It's like checking your email or your Slack all the time, or even scrolling through LinkedIn. I think this is a reason why LinkedIn works so well is because scrolling through LinkedIn is a way to feel productive at work. When it's like the afternoon, you're like, I'm doing something work related, but it's not really.

Amanda Glaeser (40:55):

[inaudible 00:40:55] 3:00. [inaudible 00:40:57].

Courtney Johnson (40:58):

3:00, you're like, let's see what's going on, LinkedIn. Well go take up space on LinkedIn because everyone's scrolling at 3:00 to try to look productive at the office.

Amanda Glaeser (41:05):

Interesting. Is that true, though? Is that real? There are certain times of day where LinkedIn flares up the usage?

Courtney Johnson (41:13):

Yes, but LinkedIn is so global that it's really geography.

Amanda Glaeser (41:20):

So 3:00 in the United States-

Courtney Johnson (41:22):

3:00 in the US.

Amanda Glaeser (41:23):

... Is not the same as-

Courtney Johnson (41:24):

Yes, exactly. Yeah, there's a billion people on LinkedIn now, so that's huge all over the world but I post everything in the morning because I also feel like that's a morning task too. You are a little bit afraid to tackle your inbox, so you're just going to check LinkedIn first. But yes, check your LinkedIn messages. There's always, and a lot of people think LinkedIn messages, it's only recruiters in there or whatever, but it could be someone that wants to interview you for something. It could be a small side project you take on. It could be somebody, maybe a college student wanting some advice, or even somebody that potentially wants to work for the company that you're at and wants a referral. There's so many opportunities that can come out of it. So yeah, check your messages.

Amanda Glaeser (42:05):

So we've talked a lot about LinkedIn, about TikTok, Instagram. So these are channels that you use to post your content, but another thing that you do a lot of is you create these courses that you have people sign up for. Just in general, what I think is really interesting about your solopreneurship is you have this personal brand where you create educational content on making content, and then you just look at a lot of different ways to tell people about that. Tell me about that kind of mentality around not just doing TikTok or LinkedIn or courses, but a little bit of everything.

Courtney Johnson (42:47):

Yeah, I want to have multiple streams of income, so I'm not reliant on one thing because I've been laid off. I've also been a freelancer that has had one huge client, that contract goes down and multiple times where I relied too much on one thing. So in monetizing my knowledge around social media and marketing and content and all of that, I try to find different streams so I'm not focused only on one thing.

Courtney Johnson (43:16):

So I have a paid Patreon, I have a mentorship program, and then yeah, I have my courses on Maven, which is also a really good tool. They're actually here in Austin as well, and it's a great live teaching platform. So it's not an asynchronous course, it's like you're going through with small groups, and just the results that come out of it are much bigger because there's that, again, similar to the stuff on Flown, you're seeing other people do the same thing as you're doing it and the motivation that comes from it is really great because when it comes to something like social media, the cringe mountain is so big that you almost have to have that support or you're just not going to do it, and I would be putting off stuff that's not helping people.

Amanda Glaeser (43:58):

Yeah, and I think what's so interesting about the course and then taking the class because it's not async, is that, yeah, you meet people and then you can get over it together. There's something really powerful in the community part of it.

Courtney Johnson (44:08):

Yeah, absolutely.

Amanda Glaeser (44:09):

So would you say that the community that you've been able to create around these different courses around all of the people that you've taught, people that reach out to you in the comments or maybe text you on the side or email you on the side, is that what keeps you going? Does that lead to growing your passion and what you're doing with this brand, teaching people about their personal brands?

Courtney Johnson (44:34):

Yeah, what keeps me going is seeing the results. Seeing somebody reach out and say, oh, I got a job because of you, or, I got my first client because of you. Or maybe someone that runs a brand account and they're like, we're seeing more traction because we're implementing this stuff on our Instagram or TikTok or whatever. Seeing other people's results is what keeps me going, because I'm like, okay, I'm having an impact. This is important, I need to keep doing what I'm doing. I'm really passionate about it too. It's very fun and I am obsessed with it. It is a fun thing, and again, I think if you follow your obsession, it's hard to not lose as long as you keep going.

Amanda Glaeser (45:12):

So then what's hard about your day-to-day then? If you're doing what you're passionate about all the time, what's the part that you're like, oh man, I got to do this today?

Courtney Johnson (45:24):

I hate to say it publicly, but the hardest part is client work, because I'm still doing client work, and I'm not to the point yet where I can release those projects and only focus on my own content. So the thing that I'm like, I don't really like this, is making other people's content. Making, it's not that I don't like it, it's definitely been a fun part and a very important part of my journey, but I don't want to do social media management of other people's stuff forever because it's almost like writing for somebody else, creating art for somebody else, or even for a brand. It's like creating something through a voice that's not even a real human. So that can be draining, especially since I'm using my creative energy on something else. So I'd like to do less of that, and that's what I dread. Sorry, clients, love you guys.

Amanda Glaeser (46:13):

So as you're managing other people's brands, what is it that they're doing wrong? Just in general, what do B2B, B2C companies, what are they not implementing that you think would make them more successful?

Courtney Johnson (46:27):

Yeah, the main reason why most organizations just suck on social media is there's not a ton of creative freedom for the marketing team. I think we have this battle of maybe like a CRO or maybe the head of marketing or whatever, battling with the team of marketing being like, no, I actually really understand the culture of what I'm putting out. Like with this, you guys understand the culture of podcasts and you understand what goes into it. Same as social, you have to really understand the culture of social, but that's really hard to explain to someone that's leading the marketing team that maybe isn't super involved in that. So I think there's way too much over planning, over strategizing, and not enough art in it, like actual creative, fun ideas. That's number one.

Courtney Johnson (47:16):

Number two, there's not enough people. Most brands only feed all of their content through a non-human entity. It is their logo and their branding, which is so important. It is so important, but if they want their customers to connect, they have to incorporate people. Maybe that is doing some sort of content series with your team, with your founder, CEO, whoever, doing some sort of thought leadership, having employee takeovers of a page. Just having people on the page is what is going to want to make people follow. Too much buttoned up, on brand, having to be that all the time, nobody wants to follow that. Nobody is excited for your next webinar. What they are excited for is becoming a better version of themselves and what your webinar can help them do. Oh, you can help them learn to use the product in this way that impresses their boss, where it actually saves them three hours of work a week. That's how you need to be positioning stuff.

Courtney Johnson (48:12):

Then again, coming in from personal brands and people, don't just promote this random logo of a webinar you're doing, but who's the person behind it? Who are you going to be learning from? Why are they cool? Why do you want to hear from them? When you can have a human focused social media, it's always going to perform well, but being too brand focused actually doesn't work.

Amanda Glaeser (48:33):

Yeah, I think that's really cool too, just the circular nature of that. So if employees or just people in general have a strong personal brand and then they can lend that to the company's brand, then they can essentially, what's that word?

Courtney Johnson (48:51):

Symbiotic?

Amanda Glaeser (48:52):

Yeah, symbiotic.

Courtney Johnson (48:52):

Symbiotic, yes. A symbiotic relationship. Well, this is a great example of a great social strategy, is creating a podcast with humans, like actual people in your organization that your audience can get to know and really find value in. Then having people like me and other guests on the podcast, it's great. This is a human focused social media strategy that you can obviously distribute this content. It's way, it's infinitely more entertaining and valuable than being like, here's our newest product feature. That's great, but it's really hard to get people to care. It's hard. It's hard.

Amanda Glaeser (49:31):

So evidence of that kind of success then is when somebody reaches out to you and says, hey, I got a job, or asks a question about, hey, how would I do this? How would I approach this situation with my boss? We touched on this already, just that that means your content was successful and that helps drive your passion, but how does, as cheesy as it sounds, how does that make you feel when you find out your content has worked and it's achieved its goal?

Courtney Johnson (50:00):

At first it made me feel almost bad because I couldn't... If somebody's like, oh, you look great today, and you're like, oh, well I got this shirt for $10 on the sale rack, you're almost putting down yourself.

Amanda Glaeser (50:10):

I totally do that.

Courtney Johnson (50:13):

Me too. So I would actually play it down, and I felt insecure about it. I'm like, well, you did it yourself, I didn't really help you because you could have. I realized that I wasn't allowing myself to take a compliment. So yeah, it made me feel bad, and then I had to get over and now I feel empowered. It used to scare me, which is important to think about because a lot of times these wins that happen in our life or with content creation, you go viral. Something great happens, whatever, it can feel scary where you shut down. The amount of people I've talked to that are like, I went viral once, scared the shit out of me, totally deleted my account. So yeah, started off feeling insecure about it, but now I'm feeling more confident and really happy. Again, it's so encouraging because it makes me want to keep going.

Amanda Glaeser (50:59):

So how do you respond now, instead of saying, oh my gosh, I got this shirt for only $10? What's the equivalent now?

Courtney Johnson (51:04):

Yeah, just gratitude. I say thank you, not just thank you for telling me that, but thank you for your encouragement. I let them know, thank you for being here and supporting me. Again, it's a symbiotic relationship. Yeah, just with gratitude.

Amanda Glaeser (51:19):

I love that. Okay, well, thank you again for coming on one of our inaugural episodes of The Rough Draft. We're so excited to have you, I think that was such a fun conversation that we had.

Courtney Johnson (51:29):

Yeah, this was great. Thank you so much for having me.

Amanda Glaeser (51:31):

Yeah, we're going to put all of the information about the tools and the things that you mentioned in the show notes, and then also, you have a podcast coming out this month as well. Tell me about it.

Courtney Johnson (51:42):

So I have a podcast called Slay the Gatekeeper. It comes out sometime in February and it's all about un-gate keeping, the cheat codes of life. So we have career cheat codes, marketing cheat codes, personal brand cheat codes, and then cheat codes about some other topics. It's going to be a lot of fun, but we're cutting the fluff, getting right to tactical wins, tactical things that you can implement in your life right now that are going to make a big change. So I'm really excited about that project.

Amanda Glaeser (52:09):

Okay, and where can people reach you? Where can they find you? Find out about the podcast, your Patreon, all of that good stuff?

Courtney Johnson (52:15):

Yeah, you can find me on Instagram Courtlynnjohnson, or on TikTok at cortney..johnson, and all of my info, all my links, everything is there.

Amanda Glaeser (52:25):

Awesome. Well, thanks again for joining us and thanks for such a fun chat.

Courtney Johnson (52:29):

Thank you, Amanda.

Amanda Glaeser (52:32):

All right, that's it for today's episode of The Rough Draft. To learn more about our guest and to find links and resources related to the conversation, check out rev.com/podcast. That's rev.com/slash podcast. If you enjoyed today's conversation, be sure to rate and subscribe, in order to stay up to date with the latest episodes, and help other creatives find us. Thank you for listening and we look forward to seeing you again on the next episode of The Rough Draft.

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